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The 'flat ride' future

Ben

Ben

TS Founding Member
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After having a catch up of the Rispaw topic (in my eyes ridiculous prospect on a 17 year old ride) - I've been thinking about Alton's flat ride situation.

In my personal history Alton would build a rollercoaster then pop in 2/3 flat flat rides to support the area, (like Nemesis, came with Rispaw and Astrodancer, then Oblivion with Enterprise and Energiser - even replaced with Submission) although I realise this was the non-merlin days. Since then we've had a turn of creating a much more rollercoaster ride turn to the park:
'Ug land'/ DF lost 2 flats and gained a coaster
X sector gained a coaster and lost a flat
Forbidden Valley has (over time) gained a coaster lost a flat

The only area to get an actual flat ride is Heave Ho, with the possible exception of Battle Galleons which is really a water ride but Im willing to play ball a little.

Why on earth should one area have 2 coasters and no flat rides, if they both happen to have issues and go down, you are left with hundreds of people swarming away from the area with nothing better to do.

Flat rides have a place in a park, particularly a coaster heavy park where the marketing care more about which gimmick they can push than guest satisfaction or through-put. Weve been left with a park that seems run by a marketing department who only care about what papers they get into, at the loss of guest experience and a decent day out.

At what point does it seem plausible to the UKs leading park that moving a 17 year old ride, which has been stripped of most of its themeing, barely makes it through a season and is likely beyond its life expectancy is a sensible idea. I assume its that desperate marketing department trying to push it as new again.

If we look at the flats on park:
(again, the UKs leading theme park)
Blade* - 34 years old! 30 BLOODY 4!
Toadstool (Chair swinger) is 30 years old
Enterprise* is 30 years old
Marauders (tea cups) is 27 years old
Gallopers is 23 years old
Ripsaw is 17 years old
Heave Ho is 6 years old.

* - Blade and Enterprise were both relocated to the park. So they are older than that.

Why do Merlin hate flats so much? Is it because the Marketing team find them less interesting (and more effort) to promote, is it because Merlin Studios cant be bothered to theme a flat ride (as the return is too little), or just because there is no demand for flats... I mean those 30 year old flats are so unpopular, thats why theyve had a short shelf life.

--

Note: Bloody well done to the maintenance team, keeping rides going at 30+ years is amazing.
 
I would consider Nemesis: Sub-Terra a flat ride so there is evidence to show Merlin are willing to invest in flat rides at thier parks (Even if it is a similar concept to what they have done at other Merlin attractions), but agree with you about Dark Forest, which is lacking a flat ride to give guests something to queue for when Rita or 13 breakdown, or even when the queues for those rides are to long.

I think there was talk or at least some concept idea for Robot Arm Flat rides for the Dark Forest, but it never saw the light of day. A shame really, as the concept art looked really good.

I think the mistake Alton Towers made was installing N:ST in Forbidden Valley, when the Dark Forest is lacking in any flat rides. That being said, I think the addition of N:ST is good as it helps tell the story of Nemesis, its just a shame they could not add N:ST and something to Dark Forest at the same time. A drop towers would not work in Dark Forest, because that is what 13 does, but something else needed to be looked at to try and solve the lack of flat rides in that area. Hex is just a little to far to be considered a flat ride within the Dark Forest.

Ripsaw been moved to Dark Forest I would find a more beliveable rumour than X-Sector, as this would help fix the issue of the lack of flat rides in Dark Forest, while still fitting the theme. It has been 5 years now since there was a flat ride in the Dark Forest, and sadly it does not look like that is going to change anytime soon.

We have seen one flat ride break, and the cost of fixing it mean the ride has been removed. It will be interesting to see what Merlin do if another flat ride breaks at Alton.

Ian
 
Yep, travelling fair technology has improved so most people see flat rides at the fair, if they are in a theme park they need a strong theme, such as Sub Terra offers.

I agree Dark Forest needs something more but it needs to be a fully themed attraction and not just a simple flat ride.
 
Flat ride are in fairs. Rollercoasters are in fairs. Dark rides are in fair. Sometimes water rides are in fairs.

By that logic Alton Towers should have nothing. ;)

There's a big difference between a fair and a theme park. Rollercoasters, dark rides, water rides and flat rides are all completely different when you step into a theme park.

A flat ride is just as important as a rollercoaster in my eyes.
 
On topic. I think the reason we haven't seen a flat ride for so long is because it doesn't draw in the public. The main draw is always the big attractions. Unless it's a big attraction or an IP people just aren't interested. However when guests visit a park they are drawn into these flat rides straight away, they compliment the area and the major rides.

I think that's the struggle Towers find, there are probably people who want a flat ride there, but due to it not being something you can market easily marketing probably aren't interested in having one put in the park.

I think the easy solution is to add flat rides with major rides. Flat rides are cheap, they could have easily added one with Th13teen and The Smiler, it wouldn't have detracted from the major ride or marketing, the flat ride would help calm queues and the price of it would be a little more justified.
 
In my view, Alton's coaster to flat ratio is massively out of whack. The line up is far too coaster heavy. Flat rides are needed to help soak up crowds and perhaps more importantly provide some variety in the type of ride experience available.

As mentioned above, we all know the reason why Alton doesn't install flats. It's because Merlin doesn't see them as marketable. The result is that we end up with a park that has nothing but headline attractions without anything to back them up. It means that a typical visitor spends the entire day queuing for 7 or 8 major rides rather than enjoying a variety of many smaller rides over the course of their visit.

For me, the theme park experience comes from wandering around the park, hopping on the odd ride, seeing a show, eating at a restaurant and generally taking in the atmosphere. It should basically be a relaxing day out. Whilst they are undoubtedly the highlight, coasters are still just a part of that overall experience.

I'm concerned that Alton has become a bit of a slog. It's a two dimensional day. You're pretty much either queuing for a coaster or riding one. It's a shame that Merlin only seems to be able to focus its energy on the newest attraction and doesn't seem to care how the park works as a whole.

Also, I for one don't consider Sub Terra to be a flat.
 
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Danny said:
There's no excuse as to why they can't invest in flats. Thankfully other parks in the UK are doing it now, so hopefully we see a game changer soon.
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There isn't a flat that's a game changer IMO.

Screaming Swings, Sky Swat, Huss Jump 2, rides that are still even now visually stunning for a flat.

I don't like riding flats, the spinning, eugh, but I love watching the visually impressive ones. They can be as much a draw to a park and add real presence.

In terms of theme park suitable ones, they're all largely the same format now and look pretty boring.

I guess demand drives innovation in this case, rather than innovation driving demand, such is the marketplace - until a manufacturer decides to go big on a new design they'll continue churning out carbon copies of each others rides.

Maybe a Zamperla Energy Storm for Dark Forest
energystorm_gallery_02.jpg
 
TheMan said:
Maybe a Zamperla Energy Storm for Dark Forest
energystorm_gallery_02.jpg
Click to expand...

That just looks like a fairground ride put inside a nicely themed cover. I think theme park rides need to think more about the lighting etc, fairgrounds are always covered in hundreds of bulbs like this and doing the same on a park ride makes it look like a cheap fairground one.
 
jon81uk said:
That just looks like a fairground ride put inside a nicely themed cover.
Click to expand...

That's my point about flats in general nowadays, I just thought that was a nice compact cheap flat they could drop into DF without too much bother, height issues etc.

Unless they can buy a working Jump2 themed to a giant tree of course which would be epic but as has been discussed, not reliable, perhaps over rated, centre is impossible to get on site, but still - imagine that in the middle of Rita's helix?

Now that would have some serious visual impact.
 
jon81uk said:
That just looks like a fairground ride put inside a nicely themed cover. I think theme park rides need to think more about the lighting etc, fairgrounds are always covered in hundreds of bulbs like this and doing the same on a park ride makes it look like a cheap fairground one.
Click to expand...

You can say that any flat ride is just a fairground ride put inside a nice themed cover though...

Compare things like Twirling Toadstool or Boneshaker to their 'normal' counterparts, and that's the difference...

There's also no reason why a theme park flat ride can use on board lights to it's advantage either... Not that they'll ever get used in an UK park...
 
Personally I dont count Hex and Sub:Terra as flat rides, more as experiences - they have a story and take time to go through; you dont just hop on and off.

As CGM pointed out (in a much more eloquent style than I can) its not just about rollerocasters, and queuing for them. You might look at a queue think its too long and decide to nip on a supporting flat. Or just be walking and think 'Oh ill go on that ride' as you discover it without having to commit a massive chunk of your day to the queue.

I think flat rides can be themed and not look like cheap fair rides, I mean look at Toy Story Playland at DLP that is all flat rides and they certainly dont look like they have been loaned from a travelling fair. Even look back to Ripsaw when it was first installed had some excellent theming.

You'd have thought Merlin would jump at the potential cheaper rides, but Marketing seem to not agree.
 
Another idea, the Unicoaster



Seem to be quite popular by those who've ridden them, again small footprint, easy to theme, these kinds of things would indeed soak up some queues and would be a great foil to The Smiler as another "correctional" device, a lot people wont even know these things exist.
 
They's need a pair of them, or a giant version, to have the throughput.
 
What's the average to pay for a decent flat? I would take a guess at £300-500k. Maybe £1m including marketing and theming.

Could they tag at least one onto any major investment, and market them together? The investment would then still have the 'USP' and would still be easily marketable and only 5-10% of the budget would have been spent on the supporting flat? People would still flock for the roller-coaster (or any major attraction) alone, but would also have an extra ride to advertise as part of the area. Not 'check out our new record breaking coaster', more 'check out our new attractions for 2013 including a record breaking coaster' - the flat would also provide support to the major attraction as many have afore mentioned.

Another point someone mentioned, which I totally agree with, is that people do like a good ride count, even the GP IMHO and flats certainly help with this. It just feel better getting on more rides, especially on busy days. Especially if these rides fit in with the area/theme - Granted, even ripsaw is only loosely related to nemesis, and certainly not obviously.

Personally, I enjoy flats as much as coasters. I prefer Rush, Slammer, Ripsaw to Collossus, X or Rita for example.
 
People will still buy fastrack though. Lots of people buy it without even seeing how long queues are, and even when there are quite a few queues, you see people using fastrack on rides with no queues anyway. Nemesis the other day was practically walk-on, yet there were people waiting to use fastrack...
 
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