[The Smiler] Construction Updates and Ride Speculation

[James]

My concern is the amount of concrete for this ride too.

Luckily with Oblivion it's only the drop area where a heavy use of concrete can be seen. With this, you've got almost the whole site covered in it. If they don't jet wash it yearly it will look awful in a few years time.

I'll be awaiting until the full thing is built though, as the concrete may not be noticeable when everything is constructed.

 

[Dave]

My concern is the amount of concrete for this ride too.

Luckily with Oblivion it's only the drop area where a heavy use of concrete can be seen. With this, you've got almost the whole site covered in it. If they don't jet wash it yearly it will look awful in a few years time.

I'll be awaiting until the full thing is built though, as the concrete may not be noticeable when everything is constructed.

Oblivion Concrete:

Drop Zone (lots)
Queue line (lots, the whole queue is lined by concrete)
2 queue tunnels (lots)
Station (concrete effect)
Tunnel exit (lots)
Queue tower (concrete effect)

Don't forget you are seeing Oblivion now after 14 years of planting having a chance to grow. In 1998 I promise you it was concrete city. Also The Smiler is at the moment a construction site.

 

[rightbackgranty]

There is an awful lot of concrete around oblivion but thankfully it is broken up by the planting in the queue line.

I just worry that they won't be able to achieve this with The Smilers queue line. Whilst oblivion a queue is the old style, free flowing, non cattlepen design (allowing planting) what we have seen of the Smilers queue is that it won't have those characteristics.

It may end up looking quite drab unless an effort is made to put down planting. Yes, it will take a couple of years to grow out but that I can cope with. 13 looked offensively bare when it opened but i imagine it looks much nicer now plants have had time to grow

 

[Rollercoasters4Life]

Who says they are not going to do something with the concrete in the queue? They could tarmac it like Th13teen or block pave it maybe? With the queue being cattle-pen like you won't really see it to much when your not in the queue. Its the outside Plaza and the pit that will be the worst part. Unless, like I say they tarmac/block pave the Plaza and somehow theme the pit.

Can I see any of it happening? I don't know, although I hope so.

 

[Benzin]

Cos what people are going to be thinking/looking at in the area is the concrete floor...

"Sod the coaster, why am I stood on a mass concrete area? OUTRAGE!"

 

[rightbackgranty]

Cos what people are going to be thinking/looking at in the area is the concrete floor...

"Sod the coaster, why am I stood on a mass concrete area? OUTRAGE!"

A slight exaggeration, but what has been said still rings true. I think what people are hoping to avoid is the very American "car park" coasters that can be seen at 6 flags - that frankly look abysmal. Concrete ages horrifically, and there is a lot of it on site. I don't think that there is anything wrong with wanting to cover up the concrete that isn't being used by queueline.

Disney wouldn't settle for a concrete cattlepen, so why should we?

 

[TheMan]

I would like to distance myself from some of TheMan's comments, not at all because I think he is wrong, but he dislikes The Smiler's image/concept, whereas I really do.

Can I thank you Bill for a very well thought out post. Indeed I have no problems with people disagreeing but all the "I don't understand people who have an opinion different to mine!1!!!1" nonsense is what ruins a good debate, not the discussion itself.

I just wanted to address something, I do like The Smilers concept and image in it's own right - love it in fact (this is where some of our friends, seem to get a bit... confused... WHAT, he agrees but disagrees... DOES... NOT.... COMPUTE). Honestly...

Yes folks, this is actually possible you know.

Anyway Bill (I digress), my issue is with how the theme for me at least, no longer is the direction it seemed to be flowing in for many months (as a few other members have also mentioned), has had a back story plonked onto Oblivion which didn't need one. And why should we rob new generations of coaster riders and theme enthusiasts the chance to ride it unsullied exactly? Just because you have already - very selfish attitude quite frankly. (Not addressed to you that bit Bill obviously).

It is also the prospect of having a giant 90s car wash disco rave plonked next to a ride, whose stark, imposing minimalism is about to get potentially ruined by the proverbial "noisy neighbour".

However, take away any link to the terrifying, or at least BRILLIANTLY themed (mostly) Sanctuary (well, when it's going full pelt anyway, my run through was a bit damp squib), don't impose it upon the dark, sinister, minimalist Oblivion and I actually love it!

This is one I wish they hadn't tried to shoehorn in. I still think air is ridiculous in Forbidden Valley.

Also, I was not one of those posting in any forum about SW6.

So yes, it's not the ride or theme within itself I have an issue with, it is being linked to the very brilliantly contrasting welcoming/deeply disturbing balance of The Sanctuary (which The Smiler has none of), and now the stark sinister minimalism and obvious play on fear of Oblivion that had nothing to do with behaviour etc.

And to the rest again, if I choose to pass comment and opinion on the obvious theme clashes, and happen to be passionate about it as an... enthusiast... then that is precisely what I shall do. There was an opportunity here to create a completely coherent theme and they didn't, which for me is a total waste.

The ride/theme on its own though, that is a different matter!

 

[Dave]

I disagree there is any lack of theme coherence and I think people are putting a lot of assumption on how Oblivion will be affected.

Oblivion has little story, the queue videos however discus the effects of the extremes of fear on the mind and body. Essentially suggesting that riders will come off the ride a changed person. Oblivion has a human experimentation theme, it uses some comedy to make its statement and has a dark foreboding Mis-en-scen.

I'm going to avoid making major assumptions about The Smiler as very little is public yet about the whole package. However the use of concrete matches X-Sectors theme, it has a human experimentation theme and it is certainly a sinister theme too (if that logo isn't freaky then I don't know what is).

Now they could have carbon copied Oblivions theme but then where is the rides identity? It seems to me they have taken the X-Sector base theme and added an interesting and unique idea for a style of human experimentation. Based on the clinical style of the station interior on the game its hardly deviated too far from The Sanctuary but The Sanctuary story is meant to be a primitive method of Marmalisation compared to The Smiler.

The element on the legs are big show pieces to make an impact on a fast moving vehicle that more subtle effects such as those in The Sanctuary just wouldn't get noticed. It takes a dark theme and then twists a Bizzare humour into it.

IF this is constructed well in real life it will compliment X-Sector without overshadowing the existing rides, if its constructed badly then we will get another Th13teen in regards to theme but we have no way of knowing until it opens. But the concept and style to me works very well.

And as for The Ministry being behind Oblivion, makes logical sense to me. They won't change the rides theme and I doubt you will notice any change. It's just a bit of clever back story primarily I imagine to please those who like deeper stories without putting any need for those who don't give a damn to understand.

So Oblivion will still be all about fear, just as it was when it closed in November, it just now has some company next-door.

But we will see soon enough, these things always create a divergence of opinion.

 

[TheMan]

But we will see soon enough, these things always create a divergence of opinion.

Couldn't agree more Dave, and I find your take on it interesting. I enjoy differences of opinion, most often you find the answer is somewhere in the middle ground. The ride will through its entire life be opined upon in a subjective manner, as anything creative is.

 

[Sku]

Can we make a separate thread for:
-Questions and answers with special guest TheMan
-Discussion on whether we agree or disagree with TheMan's posts

It would help keep this thread a lot more coherent, and more focussed on the topic at hand. The last 20 pages at least have just been critiques of TheMan's posts. Very hard to follow for casual readers.

Just my thoughts on this thread after trying to follow it for the past several months!

In before 'it would be a very boring discussion forum if...' stock reply.

 

[Noonie99]

I just feel stressed lol

 

[Danny]

I miss the days of the Thirteen construction topics.

 

[James]

I miss Leeroy "B&M" 2009.

May be we should all stop jumping on TheMan's back and actually discuss the ride now.

 

[TheMan]

*Chuckles*

I have a bit more of a thicker skin than to be too worried about what people on a forum think of me or my opinions lol! ;D

I just love how rather than have any, some folk just like to talk about everyone elses - at least I take the time, liked or not, to get stuck in, get passionate, and form and maintain my own opinions - and enjoy discussing it properly with people whom have differing ones.

I kinda got the impression that is what a forum was for

That's why I joined anyway.

I thought I was going to get another thread all of my own then too! The Man's SW7 thread where anything goes ;D - well, colour me disappointed!

As you were...

:twirly:

 

[Earthwürm]

I like the sound of 'Questions and answers with special guest TheMan!' In fact, forget the questions, how about 'Opinion time with TheMan' a blog to be updated daily with an essay on his 'Opinion of the day'. I'd definitely give it a read!

All praise aside TheMan, you're still wrong
I think the problem is you created something in your head from the snippets of information we had, and now that hasn't come to be you're disappointed! I get that you don't like how this theme has panned out, and that is fine, nothing I could say would convince you to like it, but I don't see how the theme has changed at all...we just have a bit more info on it.

I don't consider myself an Alton Towers fan really, I started out that way, but now there's not a whole lot I love about the place beyond the towers and gardens. I do however enjoy good theme parks and I like this community so this is where I choose to participate.
So now were clear I'm no Alton fanboy, I still have to give them credit, this is the best thing they have done in a long long time. I'm not a big fan of the concrete jungle theme and I'm not overly fond of gersts, but I think for once it hasn't beaten them and they've created something incredible in spite of the challenges. Perhaps it's just years of watching them churn out crap after more crap, but this is the first thing at towers to excite me for a very long time.

 

[Dave]

Can we head back on Topic.

TheMan already has his own dedicated topic, such is the impact he has made. It can be found in The Tavern

 

[TheMan]

Can I add, it isn't my fault they are building this thing slower than a snail race in local county fayre.

At least me being me gives you something to discuss ha-ha! I will be most happy for an interjection of bendy metal goodness! This is the first closed season I have spent on a forum and it is absolutely hilarious how tetchy everyone gets. Coaster DT's FTL.

I'm not accusing everyone with a different opinion of being a fan boy by the way, being serious here. I respect people with well formed opinions, where that respect of each others preference is mutual. The concrete for example, that doesn't bother me too much, and bizarrely I think the more dilapidated look of how it ages (when still safe of course!) actually suits an experimental facility look. Think of old military sites etc, old tunnels (air ) things like that, they have a really creepy feel to them - an aesthetic I actually think suits Oblivion's hole. The track etc of course, I preferred the original colour, I am not keen on it being basically the same as The Smiler - again I think it detracts from the impact.

This will go down like a lead balloon but I'd actually rather have the smiler track yellow, just so that Oblivion's dark theme in comparison was even more contrasting.

If they are going to contrast, do it properly, if you are going to fit something in, do it properly - heck, even an all out hostile take over of X-Sector by MOJ I think I'd have preferred than this half in half out, half makes sense etc.

The concrete doesn't concern me so much, it may not suit The Smiler so much though - and does no one else think this also detracts from Oblivion's drop view having that manic contraption opposite? It is a great view of the ride yes, but does it not take away from what the focus is supposed to be?

Remember how imposing The Smiler is.

Kind reminds me of getting a new toy, and not giving a crud about the old one anymore.

 

[Rob]

This will go down like a lead balloon but I'd actually rather have the smiler track yellow, just so that Oblivion's dark theme in comparison was even more contrasting.

Good job you weren't planning the ride then, as it would never have been built with yellow track. During the construction of The Smiler I have been able to fully appreciate why Towers can't build nicely coloured coasters that have any real height to them. When you are standing in fields looking over to the park it is incredible how much the big yellow cranes stand out compared to the back of The Smiler or Oblivion. Any bit of unnatural colour in the park is very easily spottable from outside of the park, you can even see the red top of Twirling Toadstool from some places a good few miles away.

 

[Olii]

It could potentially detract from the imposing view of Blivvy's drop, and to be completely honest I'm a little worried about that. But maybe it will just add to the imposing look of X-Sector as a whole? I suppose those are just two different ways of looking at it. I don't think The Smiler will overshadow Oblivion as much now that the track has been repainted, I mean a shining black tangle of steel next to a grey straight line? I don't think it would have been fair to shame the old girl like that.
I think it was a silly move to put The Smiler next to Oblivion though, as this does mean it will look slightly less intimidating to the GP because The Smiler "Haz lyek a milyion loopdeloops innit blad" and this does cause some concern to me because one of Oblivion's major themes is intimidation...

 

[TheMan]

I think it was a silly move to put The Smiler next to Oblivion though, as this does mean it will look slightly less intimidating to the GP because The Smiler "Haz lyek a milyion loopdeloops innit blad" and this does cause some concern to me because one of Oblivion's major themes is intimidation...

Yes great points Olii, even though these are opinions I very much share, obviously I have made a total arse out of myself with another opinion by forgetting the colour restrictions at the Towers hahaha:

Good job you weren't planning the ride then, as it would never have been built with yellow track.

Thanks for that Rob. Bet you took great pleasure from that post mate ;D - revenge will be mine, be assured.

SMH at myself.