Thirteen: General Discussion

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Matt N, 1st May 2021.

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  1. Jb85

    Jb85 TowersStreet Member

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    Isnt it funny how all of a sudden it can’t operate in the rain - what’s that all about
     
  2. jon81uk

    jon81uk TowersStreet Member

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    was discussed a few pages back.
    General assumption is that the tires on the lift need replacement with ones that grip better in the rain. But AT maintenance team is short staffed so it didn’t get done in main season. Hopefully will get done in closed season.
    Also there was a little bit of attention from Twitter etc when a train did slip down the lift hill and roll back to the station so the park was being overly cautious and not running it in wet weather.
     
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  3. DistortAMG

    DistortAMG TowersStreet Member

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    I would say they just need replacing fullatop. Not with better ones. The ones they have, have worked fine for a long time.
     
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  4. rob666

    rob666 TowersStreet Member

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    We do not know the quality of recent replacement tyres.
    Good grip tends to cost more, and wears out quicker.
    Cutting corners with budgets may have kicked them up the bottom.
    That is what I heard from a senior ride op's sister's hairdresser.
    And quite a few other people as well.
     
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  5. DistortAMG

    DistortAMG TowersStreet Member

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    I very much doubt they have cut corners on what is essentially a safety critical item. They would never have cut corners in that respect anyway, even more so since the Smiler.

    Seeing as this only started happening towards the end of the season, there is a delay in getting stuff off the continent (these could be sourced direct from Intamin) and towers also have a shortage of engineers. I would say this strongly points towards the tires being worn out that have not been replaced, rather than cheaper ones.

    Drive tires of this type are a fairly bespoke item, especially in the UK..it is probably the only ride in the UK with drive tyres of those exact dimensions with those inner and outer ring diameters and thickness ect. Once you've paid a tyre manufactuer the cost of manufacturing them, including the cost of custom tooling, that only you are going to need as no one else has tyres that specific size, you are probably looking at a cost as high, if not higher than going to the manufactuer or a manufacturer approved supplier. Both of which will not be located in the UK. So lead times will also be a massive factor in the wake of Brexit. Another possible cause of the issue.
     
    Last edited: 27th Nov 2021
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  6. Russ

    Russ TowersStreet Member

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    Looking at pictures and from memory I would say the drive tyres are just standard 3.50x6 cart tyres, with a gel filling instead of air. These tyres are a tube type and would constantly rub the tube causing a flat after just a couple of days on this sort of setup.

    When it comes to that size and application there really isn't a lot of brands to choose from apart from Duro and maybe Kenda.

    Sent from my AC2003 using Tapatalk
     
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  7. Jonathan

    Jonathan TowersStreet Member

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    Anyone would think you worked with tyres, mate. :p
     
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  8. Russ

    Russ TowersStreet Member

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    Well you know ;)

    Sent from my AC2003 using Tapatalk
     
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  9. djtruefitt

    djtruefitt TS Site Team Team Member

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    From what I hear some kind of block brake will be added at the bottom of the lift, I assume on the straight bit of track after you’ve come out the station, so if it ever did slip back through the tyres again, then it would be stopped on the break and not roll back in to the station.

    Another year and another shoddy Intamin bodge on TH13TEEN.

    However knowing Merlin and towers, they’ll probably deem that not good enough and some awful looking scaffolding structure will be built over the lift hill
     
  10. JAperson

    JAperson TowersStreet Member

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    Yeah that would make a lot of sense and almost certainly solve the problem. Glad they are doing the necessary work to it.
     
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  11. DistortAMG

    DistortAMG TowersStreet Member

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    The art of the bodge eh. Atleast Intamin seem pretty good at bodging on the most part.
     
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  12. Dave

    Dave TS Founding Member

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    They get a lot of practice
     
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  13. Tom

    Tom TowersStreet Member

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    For me, I don't know enough about the latest and historical problems to blame Intimin entirely or even at all.

    Excess speed running into the second lift for example - you could have taken all the steam out with a trim immediately before rather than trimming the experience from the first drop. Did Alton Towers want the ride scaled down in terms of intensity throughout?

    Have the current tyres (if they are the issue) been installed with Intamin's endorsement?
     
  14. Rick

    Rick TowersStreet Member

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    I suspect they have to be installed on flat / straight track which is in pretty short supply on that ride.
     
  15. Dave

    Dave TS Founding Member

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    They had to trim the speed before the first humpback after the drop and trims can’t be put on the helix hence why they ended up on the drop. The issue wasn’t related to excess speed into the second lift.
     
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  16. Skyscraper

    Skyscraper TowersStreet Member

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    I thought it was primarily to stop the trains from going too fast up the second lift as that caused the ride to auto e-stop?
     
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  17. Tom

    Tom TowersStreet Member

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    That's my understanding (but only based on what's been written on here over the years). If it's a case of needing/wanting to slow the ride down throughout to tame (family-friendlify) the experience then surely that's not Intamin's fault if they built to the original specs.
     
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  18. Dave

    Dave TS Founding Member

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    It wasn’t to make it family friendly, it was related to the maximum negative g-force the restraints where rated to deal with. So very much intamins fault.
     
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  19. DistortAMG

    DistortAMG TowersStreet Member

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    Even if they built to the original specs, from my understanding, that layout would have been designed by Intamin entirely. Alton could possibly give them a rough layout they want, then Intamin would design a track and profile based on that and based on the specifications, of what that ride model can do.

    So even if they had to add trims for the reason of slowing the ride down to match the brief given by Alton, they would still be at fault as they designed and profiled the original track. So even from that angle, it would still be an Intamin cause, but I think Dave hit the nail on the head with the cause.

    I say fault very loosely. As it is a very complex thing to get right I would imagine.

    But you know, this sort of stuff isn't totally unique to Intamin. If I remember correctly, when air opened back in 2002, there was a trim brake on the track either before or after you go under the pathway, after you twist back with the track being above you, after being on your back. It was either there or on the bunny hop as you go over the maintenance shed towards the last turnaround.

    But the trim was there (probably still now) but was not hooked up. It was put in as a just incase, but was never needed.

    Point i am making is, even engineering with more precision than a swiss watch, sometimes is not totally right. In airs case it was totally right and they never needed it. I guess that sort of goes against what I just said, but you get the point I am sure.

    Intamin do seem to have to make more corrections than not though. Maybe a price to pay for pushing technology sometimes? I do not know.

    But you know what, we are where we are. It will be nice to get Thirteen back working all the time. Luckily, where these modifications are going, the ride experience shouldn't be impacted too much. (I hope!)
     
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  20. Rob F

    Rob F TowersStreet Member

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    Colossus’s brake run at Thorpe is another intamin that says hello, completely messed up from design onwards…. To the point now the trains have to stack for the ride to be able to operate. (Yes its also todo with blocks) but the brake setup was designed for higher velocity than the ride can physically achieve.
    One set of the breaks fins are disabled (possibly removed now) as a result
     
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