2023: The Curse at Alton Manor

[s_g_k]

To be fair the flume duck was far more entertaining in it's original form. As it stands now it's the equivalent of stuffing a deceased family member and plonking them on the sofa. Yes they're still there but not as you remember. Would the duck have wanted to end up like that? An ornament? Nah

True, would have been much better if it was still animated with the QUACK QUACK. Quite spine chilling actually. But the fact it’s been repurposed is still great.

 

[dave___]

Better reusing it than chucking it in the skip.

Just looks like a Boglin that’s been taken out of its cardboard box/cage to me either way…

 

[GooseOnTheLoose]

True, would have been much better if it was still animated with the QUACK QUACK. Quite spine chilling actually. But the fact it’s been repurposed is still great.

🪿

 

[Dave]

It's still a refurbishment - doesnt matter what you can see or not see, but they will still have replaced some parts and ensured they are going to be more reliable

The ride hardware is over 30 years old, changing a few circuits or parts is not going to stop downtime as that isn’t likely the issue. You would need a full control system replacement really as it’s probably the control system that is the issue.

Just look at the downtime if you don’t believe me.

 

[Nerdsticks]

What a way to respect your history Towers.

Don't look at the invitation queue then, judging from this reaction, you'll probably start foaming at the mouth.

 

[Trooper Looper]

Don't look at the invitation queue then, judging from this reaction, you'll probably start foaming at the mouth.

I know lol. Hey, at least they haven't been covered with blue paint and still look the part of the scene. I gotta give them that though, it is used well in the queue.

 

[tom_taylor]

The ride hardware is over 30 years old, changing a few circuits or parts is not going to stop downtime as that isn’t likely the issue. You would need a full control system replacement really as it’s probably the control system that is the issue.

Just look at the downtime if you don’t believe me.

Yea we understand all about that, and whilst it will have been refurbished however (think more mechanical than cosmetic with the 6th seat) - that doesn't mean everything will have been repaired replaced or be brand new!

The downtime hasn't just been due to the cars or ride system either, as we've known about the teething issues with various triggers and effects since day zero back in March.

Let's agree to disagree - it's Halloween after all!

One thing noticed with the ride system however, is since the weight has changed (book ends and gun hardware removed) the cars are smacking into each other at the end of the ride as they approach the station - we've reported it each time its occurred and they were noting down on a clipboard, so its clear some of the cars require reconfiguration for the approach section - they were also speeding some of them up through the station manually to close the gaps via the top access control hatch.

If they've had that much issues with the ride system, it'll most likely be replaced in the future, unless Mack Rides can really assist with providing some more updates, but again it all depends what AT and MMM want to pay for - which sometimes as a business it can be as little as possible.

 

[DiogoJ42]

Better reusing it than chucking it in the skip.

Just looks like a Boglin that’s been taken out of its cardboard box/cage to me either way…

I was just thinking a couple of days ago that I seem to be the only person I know who remembers “Boglins”.

Have to agree with what others have said. Keep the old props and re use them.

 

[Rob]

I'm sorry but I find this really annoying! Instead of selling the old props they to tryhard fans like what they did with Pirate Adventure and still earing some money from it, they cheaply repaint it and simply reuse it for a Halloween prop for their event. What a way to respect your history Towers.

Many theme parks around the world use theming and props from past attractions as new props/theming in things like scare attractions. It's a great use of old theming! And saves having to create new stuff from scratch.

Sounds like you're annoyed because the park did not do what you wanted them to do. How dare they.

 

[Trooper Looper]

Many theme parks around the world use theming and props from past attractions as new props/theming in things like scare attractions. It's a great use of old theming! And saves having to create new stuff from scratch.

Sounds like you're annoyed because the park did not do what you wanted them to do. How dare they.

You're right. I do like that they've reused it. I like how they reused a lot of the columns and garden theming for the Invitations queue. The only reason why I'm just a bit bothered by this one is that it's been covered over in blue paint and the eyes have been repainted to orange and it looks really cheap. Far from what the original head looked like. Perhaps people don't have a close connection to HH/Duel like I have on this thread, but if they covered over the Nemesis 'worlds most intense ride experience.' With yellow paint, I can Imagine some would be upset about that. Hope you get what I mean.

 

[Benzin]

Rather parks reuse them then sell them off to someone with more money than sense so they can win some Internet points and store it in a garage for years.

As long as reused sensibly of course. Couldn't believe it when I saw the old Rodeo centrepiece was still by Vampire lift 2.

More parks should do an Efteling and have a museum area.

 

[James]

I would love to see a museum at Towers. The place has such a rich history, it would be great if they could showcase that. Towers Street has plenty of empty units.

 

[tom_taylor]

I would love to see a museum at Towers. The place has such a rich history, it would be great if they could showcase that. Towers Street has plenty of empty units.

Towers itself is like a living museum, you just need to know where to look!

There is hope the work on the Towers may allow for such an attraction (museum) in the future for stuff from the archives, but for now we wait!

 

[Dave]

Yea we understand all about that, and whilst it will have been refurbished however (think more mechanical than cosmetic with the 6th seat) - that doesn't mean everything will have been repaired replaced or be brand new!

The downtime hasn't just been due to the cars or ride system either, as we've known about the teething issues with various triggers and effects since day zero back in March.

Let's agree to disagree - it's Halloween after all!

One thing noticed with the ride system however, is since the weight has changed (book ends and gun hardware removed) the cars are smacking into each other at the end of the ride as they approach the station - we've reported it each time its occurred and they were noting down on a clipboard, so its clear some of the cars require reconfiguration for the approach section - they were also speeding some of them up through the station manually to close the gaps via the top access control hatch.

If they've had that much issues with the ride system, it'll most likely be replaced in the future, unless Mack Rides can really assist with providing some more updates, but again it all depends what AT and MMM want to pay for - which sometimes as a business it can be as little as possible.

Let’s not agree to disagree. You stated the ride had been refurbished with the cars leaving, I pointed out that the issue is the ride systems age (amongst other things) and that the ride may have had both mechanical and cosmetic changes but the core system is still 30+ years old and now you are agreeing with my original point. I mean by all means change your mind but don’t do it in a way that tries to twist the points made by other people. That’s just odd and frustrating for those trying to engage.

They may shut down if major effects are down but you are not going to pull out the ride capacity for minor trigger issues. There are clearly other matters arising with the ride system.

 

[DistortAMG]

One thing noticed with the ride system however, is since the weight has changed (book ends and gun hardware removed) the cars are smacking into each other at the end of the ride as they approach the station - we've reported it each time its occurred and they were noting down on a clipboard, so its clear some of the cars require reconfiguration for the approach section - they were also speeding some of them up through the station manually to close the gaps via the top access control hatch.

I think this is a potential indication of the reliability issues the ride is facing. The fact the cars are hitting one another at the end and having to be sped up through the station indicates the control system is having a difficult time keeping the cars properly spaced.

This small spacing issue in the station does exaggerate itself massively over the ride course. When it's fully out of alignment, it would make sense to shut the ride, as cars would be stopping and starting continuously through the circuit, as they wait for the stopping and starting car infront to clear. Almost making it a non ride. It's not an easy thing to sort out on the fly either, which would explain why it shuts for extended periods. When the blocks are fully messed up on this specific ride, it can take hours to re align, for it to slowly drift out of alignment again as the cars go round and round all day / week.

I suspect the control system was tweaked over the years to compensate for the aging cars and whatever else. But with the new potentially refurbished motors (more torque), the cars will accelerate and decelerate slightly faster than in its older days, which catches the control system out, having a nock on effect. The ride literally runs on a very, very fine balance. Doesn't take much to throw it all out.

I am pretty sure it can be fixed with the control system being tweaked though. I suspect this is why they are noting the cars that clash on a clipboard, as they know exactly where on the circuit (if you imagine the cars as a continuous loop) that the bunching up and stretching out is happening. Fine tuning a system like that though, with the age it is, takes time. I'm sure they will sort it eventually, if that is the issue.

But fundumentaly it is a control system issue if this is the issue. I don't personally think it's specifically just due to age though. Just the cars having slightly different acceleration and deceleration characteristics than what they had last year and to what the system was eventually tweaked to. The ride had almost identical issues in 1992 with the spacing. It was, over a season and a bit, fixed. The weight of more or less people wouldn't make a difference, as the motors have enough power to drive the cars at the set speeds empty or full, kind of how an electric fork lift does the same.

Think of it as like trying to balance a bottle of pop, upside down on your hand. Takes a fine balance to keep it there, once the bottle starts going either way, it very quickly snowballs until the bottle falls off your hand.

 

[tom_taylor]

I think this is a potential indication of the reliability issues the ride is facing. The fact the cars are hitting one another at the end and having to be sped up through the station indicates the control system is having a difficult time keeping the cars properly spaced.

This small spacing issue in the station does exaggerate itself massively over the ride course. When it's fully out of alignment, it would make sense to shut the ride, as cars would be stopping and starting continuously through the circuit, as they wait for the stopping and starting car infront to clear. Almost making it a non ride. It's not an easy thing to sort out on the fly either, which would explain why it shuts for extended periods. When the blocks are fully messed up on this specific ride, it can take hours to re align, for it to slowly drift out of alignment again as the cars go round and round all day / week.

I suspect the control system was tweaked over the years to compensate for the aging cars and whatever else. But with the new potentially refurbished motors (more torque), the cars will accelerate and decelerate slightly faster than in its older days, which catches the control system out, having a nock on effect. The ride literally runs on a very, very fine balance. Doesn't take much to throw it all out.

I am pretty sure it can be fixed with the control system being tweaked though. I suspect this is why they are noting the cars that clash on a clipboard, as they know exactly where on the circuit (if you imagine the cars as a continuous loop) that the bunching up and stretching out is happening. Fine tuning a system like that though, with the age it is, takes time. I'm sure they will sort it eventually, if that is the issue.

But fundumentaly it is a control system issue if this is the issue. I don't personally think it's specifically just due to age though. Just the cars having slightly different acceleration and deceleration characteristics than what they had last year and to what the system was eventually tweaked to. The ride had almost identical issues in 1992 with the spacing. It was, over a season and a bit, fixed. The weight of more or less people wouldn't make a difference, as the motors have enough power to drive the cars at the set speeds empty or full, kind of how an electric fork lift does the same.

Think of it as like trying to balance a bottle of pop, upside down on your hand. Takes a fine balance to keep it there, once the bottle starts going either way, it very quickly snowballs until the bottle falls off your hand.

@DistortAMG thank you for making a good effort in trying to explain in more detail what i posted about earlier - all valid points - there are far too many variables (hence why i did not go into too much detail as we just don't know), however, I have worked on the ride system virtually for a project (that shall soon appear), and whilst real-world physics do apply in some aspects of the virtual ride, some of the pain can be removed in the virtual setting luckily. What i will say, is that timing and communication between the cars and the main control system is very important.

 

[RIPCorky]

@DistortAMG thank you for making a good effort in trying to explain in more detail what i posted about earlier - all valid points - there are far too many variables (hence why i did not go into too much detail as we just don't know), however, I have worked on the ride system virtually for a project (that shall soon appear), and whilst real-world physics do apply in some aspects of the virtual ride, some of the pain can be removed in the virtual setting luckily. What i will say, is that timing and communication between the cars and the main control system is very important.

Is it confirmed it's the ride system causing the issues with the ride closing down? Didn't have this much downtime when it was Duel so it must be a modification they have made?

 

[tom_taylor]

Is it confirmed it's the ride system causing the issues with the ride closing down? Didn't have this much downtime when it was Duel so it must be a modification they have made?

I spoke with some of the ride techs, they can't tell you too much but it is a combination of everything I've disclosed previously,

For example, the smoke before the fireplace trommel on opening day caused the CCTV to be blocked so they had to stop that - since it was reintroduced with better extraction for the CCTV visibility its worked better although sometimes has failed, as it sets off every 10 seconds, etc,

Sensors and triggers for effects are not always working due to the weight changing in the vehicles, although some triggers have been changed,

Silly people dropping phones and cameras so the ride has to be stopped to collect them,

Also issues with the cars - the gaps caused because not all the cars are out, the control system not timing correctly when cars are missing,

Lets hope Mack or a third party ride engineering company come in and sort it out during the closed period,

Also on a cheerful note, I've managed to find the video of the skull before the flying gouls before the garden!

 

[RIPCorky]

I spoke with some of the ride techs, they can't tell you too much but it is a combination of everything I've disclosed previously,

For example, the smoke before the fireplace trommel on opening day caused the CCTV to be blocked so they had to stop that - since it was reintroduced with better extraction for the CCTV visibility its worked better although sometimes has failed, as it sets off every 10 seconds, etc,

Sensors and triggers for effects are not always working due to the weight changing in the vehicles, although some triggers have been changed,

Silly people dropping phones and cameras so the ride has to be stopped to collect them,

Also issues with the cars - the gaps caused because not all the cars are out, the control system not timing correctly when cars are missing,

Lets hope Mack or a third party ride engineering company come in and sort it out during the closed period,

Also on a cheerful note, I've managed to find the video of the skull before the flying gouls before the garden!

Thanks, I find it odd in this day and age where by you probably walk past a reliable motion detection device such as doors to a super market or a security light and rides like this struggle to make things like this work as reliably.

 

[tom_taylor]

Thanks, I find it odd in this day and age where by you probably walk past a reliable motion detection device such as doors to a super market or a security light and rides like this struggle to make things like this work as reliably.

I agree, its frustrating, but they are using a new Show system to trigger effects, probably what they used in Gangster Granny, as it makes sense they've upgrade most of the tech so they can improve it further in the future, even though its still having issue.

There could be some complex rules in the new system which are clashing, although with the timing issue of the cars theres probably a rule which stops a scene from activating - think when they pause the ride when someones recording on a phone or camera and then the ride restarts the audio and effects don't all restart until you move to the next section.

I've been on when there was a gap in front and the car whipped round and some scenes didn't even trigger as we were going that fast!

Alot of the audio has multiple layers and depends on triggers, and sometimes i've been lucky to hear the base soundtrack in a section without the other effects or narration from Emily.