Blackpool Pleasure Beach: General Discussion

[shakey]

You do realise a year earlier Pleasure Beach had what I assume was a lot of money spent money on magnetic breaking on the final break run on the mouse? Does that really sound like the actions of a park that weren't at least trying to keep it going?

They clearly didn't try hard enough or care enough to keep it.

I know that it's not Pleasure Beach is fault

Sorry but it 100% is. They chose to demolish it. Nobody else is to blame.

It's gone and I am looking forward to icon but please do not attempt to defend the pleasure beach over the mouse's removal. It was a diabolical decision.



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[MakoMania]

It was the only sensible and rational decision given the circumstances.

The way in which it was done could have been better, but one way or another it had to go.

 

[Dipper_Dave]

I do find it funny how about 5 people have brought up my comments regarding preserving the woodies. Lol.

Obviously when you're getting accident claims for a ride it might well be time to say goodbye. Sorry guys but that's just the top and bottom of it.

I appreciated the nostalgia of it and the fact it was the last of its kind but it hit harder than Mike Tyson. Brutal ride experience and not enjoyable to me at least.

I'm not in the slightest bit sad to see it go. Yes I know....put my head on a spike for my blasphemy. I never really enjoyed it tbh. Same experience of sitting in a shopping trolley and hitting a brick wall at top speed and yes I have done both.

I don't have a problem with anybody NOT liking a ride. We all like and dislike rides, there's no right or wrong. I dislike Smiler but I see enough Smiler t-shirts about that it must be popular. But, it must be said that Nash is way rougher than the Mouse was. Mouse was intense but fun. Certain seats on Nash can be downright painful. I've as good as given up on the back row. Rows 2, 5 & 8 are the most bearable!

 

[shakey]

It was the only sensible and rational decision given the circumstances.

The way in which it was done could have been better, but one way or another it had to go.

Rubish.

It was signed off by h&s after the seatbelt changes and was ready to go.

If the park were worried about further complaints they could have tried one or more of......

* Increase the height restriction
* Add an age restriction
* Add clear information about the severity of the ride at the entrance
* Slow the ride down before the final dip (which I believe was the cause of most of the complaints due to the last 2 right hand corners)

They tried absolutley none of those things before killing one of the world's most historic coasters.

They could have even left it SBNO until they had the time and money to make any further changes they felt were needed.

It wasn't even the roughest ride on the park for goodness sake. Nash is much worse.







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[MakoMania]

^As I understand it, the insurers were not happy with the ride and were unwilling to allow it to operate unless it recieved changes that would have significantly impacted the ride experience.

I don't know that for 100% fact, but it is what I've been told by staff on more than one occasion.

 

[shakey]

^As I understand it, the insurers were not happy with the ride and were unwilling to allow it to operate unless it recieved changes that would have significantly impacted the ride experience.

I don't know that for 100% fact, but it is what I've been told by staff on more than one occasion.

If h&s say it's safe then it should be able to be insured. Although I suppose they could have asked for more money than the park were willing to pay. But would that have happened mid season ?

I still believe that mouse would be operating this year if icon hadn't been built.

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[Ash84]

^As I understand it, the insurers were not happy with the ride and were unwilling to allow it to operate unless it recieved changes that would have significantly impacted the ride experience.

I don't know that for 100% fact, but it is what I've been told by staff on more than one occasion.

True, very true.

But who ARE (or were) the insurance company? Rumour has it BPB own the insurance company, so what you are saying is they couldn' satisfy themselves....

Hmmm

 

[MakoMania]

If h&s say it's safe then it should be able to be insured. Although I suppose they could have asked for more money than the park were willing to pay. But would that have happened mid season ?

I still believe that mouse would be operating this year if icon hadn't been built.

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I don't know really, I'm not an expert in insurance, all I know is that staff have said that although it was theoretically possible to keep it open, the ride experience having to be significantly compromised and deteriorated with a whole list of changes made it not worth the risk.

BPB don't insure themselves, not for rides anyway, I hope

 

[Dipper_Dave]

It was signed off by h&s after the seatbelt changes and was ready to go.

If the park were worried about further complaints they could have tried one or more of......

* Increase the height restriction
* Add an age restriction
* Add clear information about the severity of the ride at the entrance
* Slow the ride down before the final dip (which I believe was the cause of most of the complaints due to the last 2 right hand corners)

They tried absolutley none of those things before killing one of the world's most historic coasters.

They could have even left it SBNO until they had the time and money to make any further changes they felt were needed.

I totally agree that they could have tried one or more of your bullet points. I have always found it strange that they chose to put that disclaimer board up as you queue for Grand National but that a similar sign was not put up for Wild Mouse. Surely that would have gone some way to covering the park against any claims.

I remember as a teenager seeing signs at places like Flamingoland warning about the forces exerted by certain rides and not to go on them if you have back, neck or heart problems or are pregnant. And those were relatively tame coasters compared to Wild Mouse. Why did BPB feel they needed that warning sign for Nash but not for Mouse?

 

[Coaster]

A very good point about the safety sign, it made no logical sense for Nash to have one but not Mouse considering they are/were both raucous rides.

I also noticed that the safety announcement for Mouse was off during the majority of last season, very very poor effort at satisfying H&S requirements.

I feel there is a lot that BPB could have been more proactive with in relation to securing the future of the ride, extra safety signs, a safety announcement/video could have been added, pre-dispatch spiel from the ride operator... none of which were tried.

The decision to demolish the ride was extremely poor and felt very rushed, almost as if to get it out of the way before Icon opens rather than taking time to consider any modifications which may have had to be made. I don't think the park's reputation will recover, they're losing the only thing that makes them different to any other park by removing the classics.

I think that tolerance of other people's opinions is important here, reading some of the comments they come across as very dismissive but Wild Mouse was to some one of the best roller coasters anywhere. I never found it rough or uncomfortable in the slightest but respect other's views.

 

[Temleh]

Insurance firms wouldn’t touch Mouse with a barge pole after an incident occurred on it last summer. Pleasure Beach did not plan for it to close hence the £1000s spent on new brakes and ride parts.

I assure you all that Pleasure Beach are distraught over its loss. What is questionable is the way the PR team handled it’s closure / demolition. There was no chance of “last rides”, but perhaps a behind the scenes tour or walk around would’ve been a fitting send off.

 

[Stuie]

In the case of the the Blackpool rides I'd be surprised if they weren't allowed to make some changes over time to meet modern safety requirements. They're a lower category of listed building, and although you could theoretically have a situation where the rides are SBNO because they don't meet modern safety standards but can't be demolished, I don't think the Historic England would want to see that happen.

Health and Safety trumps Historic England every time. If there’s a reason for a change the listing offers no protection.

In the case of an accident or if something is returned to use after being SBNO or rebuilt then modern safety standards are applied to it.

This is the reason why Margate’s Scenic Railway now has lapbars, seatbelts and higher sides to the cars and trim brakes on the track while Great Yarmouth’s operates as it always has!

 

[Dipper_Dave]

I think that tolerance of other people's opinions is important here, reading some of the comments they come across as very dismissive but Wild Mouse was to some one of the best roller coasters anywhere. I never found it rough or uncomfortable in the slightest but respect other's views.

Good point. I suppose if we were to remove ourselves from the coaster goon bubble we cocoon ourselves in, whether intentionally or not, from a first time rider’s perspective you can see how they might find it a shock to the system and come off with bruises. We on the other hand had learned to braces ourselves for things such as the jerk at the top of the lift hill, and angle ourselves into those last two 90 degree turns so our legs and knees didn’t get a bashing. Sadly, when all hell broke loose from the first drop right up to the brake run, some people just didn’t know how to deal with it.

but one way or another it had to go.

I wonder what the reaction would be if Nemesis closed during winter one year without warning. I don’t think “It had to go” would wash with fans of the ride somehow. As Shakey said, I don’t think it HAD to go. There were things they could have done if they’d wanted to. If the extra seatbelts in the mice that were fitted post-incident had been signed off as acceptable, then why could it not get insurance?

Oh well, all I am left with are Mouse memories, photos, and almost enough ride parts to rebuild it. And I still feel a bit sick when I walk past where it stood

 

[Ash84]

Regarding the sign, the one and only reason it is on the entrance to the Nash not the Mouse is due to the unfortunate incident a few years ago. The Nash paralysed someone, the Mouse didn't.

Safety warning played over a PA system telling you to keep arms inside a car wouldn't have made a jot of difference to the situation with the Mouse, so don't loose any sleep over not hearing them last year.

The fact is, every park will always have a best ride (or worst depending on your views) in the majority or cases Port Av's is Baco, Altons for years was Corkscrew, BPB's was the Mouse. These are the rides people moan about on social media or to their friends, rides often described as rough, dangerous ect.

Unfortunately, we in this country seem to be surrounded by snowflakes, because I have never heard or read a report from anyone is Spain whinging about Baco, yet our forums are full of these kinds of complaints, as they were for the Mouse.

The worst thing about this whole situation is once the so called problem ride is removed instantly something else becomes the new 'worst' ride, now it's the Nash. Once enough people moan about that for long enough it will be the Dipper.

Thanks to social media, and people being so dramatic these days, I fear for the long term future of a lot of my personal favourite rides. 2 of the ones I have mentioned here have already gone, and quite honestly I am sick of seeing calls for the Nash and Baco to be removed by people who simply don't like the rides for one reason or another.

 

[Dipper_Dave]

Regarding the sign, the one and only reason it is on the entrance to the Nash not the Mouse is due to the unfortunate incident a few years ago. The Nash paralysed someone, the Mouse didn't.

The worst thing about this whole situation is once the so called problem ride is removed instantly something else becomes the new 'worst' ride, now it's the Nash. Once enough people moan about that for long enough it will be the Dipper.

Thanks to social media, and people being so dramatic these days, I fear for the long term future of a lot of my personal favourite rides. 2 of the ones I have mentioned here have already gone, and quite honestly I am sick of seeing calls for the Nash and Baco to be removed by people who simply don't like the rides for one reason or another.

What I find odd about Mouse is that last season’s ‘incident’ seems to be shrouded in mystery. Was the person actually injured or not? From memory, we found out about it from a Trip Advisor comment, where someone said that their child had knocked the seat belt release with their elbow and thus COULD have gone flying out of the car if the parent hadn’t held onto them for the rest of the ride. Of course, shut the ride whilst investigations are carried out, but beyond that make the necessary modifications and reopen it. The double seatbelts were surely enough to get the ride reopened. So, after high profile incidents on Nash & Smiler, the rides continue to operate to this day, but for an incident that didn’t even make the news, Wild Mouse closes forever, ‘can’t get insured’ and gets demolished.

Good post Ash, but people were talking about Nash being rough whilst the Mouse was still operating. I agree though that sadly the whinging GP will now shift their focus to said ride as a target of their inane “This ride is old, rickety, dangerous, hurt my back and should be torn down” comments.

I totally agree that a ride shouldn’t ‘need removing’ just because you don’t happen to like it. Personally I’d remove all the spinning rides at PA and build more coasters and dark rides. But I appreciate that parks need variety in their ride line up and that many people actually like ‘spin n spew’ rides.

If you don’t like a ride, don’t go on it again. But don’t go whinging all over the internet, social media etc, that the ride shouldn’t exist.

 

[Ash84]

Being totally honest, I can't see how an elbow can cause a car-style seat belt to become unfastened. I challenge anyone here to go out to a car and try unfasten a belt with an elbow without using your other hand to hold the clasp in place, it isn't going to happen.

It has to have either been a fault on the car (unlikely) or some sort of deliberate action to cause the belt to become unfastened. It' wasn't one of those naff locking belts that are found on the Big One, those I have known to open mid ride, but never on the Mouse, and I have been riding it for 30 years in some cases for 50 times a day.

Of course, there are certain parents out there who won't accept little jonny is no angel and has undone his own belt, or may somehow of contributed to this by their own actions! Nah nah nah sir, that's never going to happen. Blame the ride, we all know it's dangerous, old, rickety and a death trap anyway so the story is already sold. It's perfectly acceptable to ignore that it's run for 59 years without major incident and that so long as a rider holds on, you could get round safely without a belt anyway! That's all irrelevant, sweep it under the carpet at once!

What is very very clear is that BPB didn't want to close the ride, so I refuse to given them a hard time over it. However the way it was done I take great exception to.

Very quickly, to answer another point made further up, personally I'd rather have no mouse than have it''s layout dotted with trims around every corner just so it can appease the snowflakes. Those of us that loved the Mouse rode it at its best. I wouldn't want to be telling future generations about how it used to be better in the old days, as they come off the coaster saying it's boring. I have to say that enough about BPB as it is!

 

[Benzin]

Thinking that Baco is rough makes me a snowflake?

There's some utter tosh posted on this forum but that is utterly taking the proverbial...

 

[Rob]

Unfortunately, we in this country seem to be surrounded by snowflakes, because I have never heard or read a report from anyone is Spain whinging about Baco, yet our forums are full of these kinds of complaints, as they were for the Mouse.

Ah yes, because Baco is rated so highly around the world apart from in the UK.

I loved Mouse, it was great fun, but Baco is a terrible terrible coaster full stop.

 

[Ash84]

Well it regularly gets over a 2 hour queue, and it hardly has a low turnaround of riders.

It has its fans, and for me it' one of the most intense and enjoyable coasters I have done to date.

Opinions on Baco are a separate thing from the point I make anyway.

 

[shakey]

Insurance firms wouldn’t touch Mouse with a barge pole after an incident occurred on it last summer.

I simply do not believe that at all. Maybe it is what pleasure beach want you to think but it doesn't wash with me.

After the incident last summer new style belts were fitted which resolved the alleged issue of a seat belt coming undone accidentally. That should have satisfied the insurers.

Also as far as I am aware there was never a serious injury on the mouse in its 59 years of operation. Other rides that continue to operate in the UK have had major injuries or worse but still get insured.....

Blackpool 2014 - Grand National - Broken Neck - Continues to operate
Blackpool 2000 - Space Invader - Death - Continues to operate (now at Brean leisure park)
Alton Towers 2015 - Smiler - Loss of Limbs - Continues to operate
Chessington 2012 - Tomb Blaster - Brain Haemorrhage - Continues to operate
Drayton Manor 2017 - Splash Canyon - Death - Expected to reopen
Oakwood 2004 - Drenched - Death - Continues to operate
Alton Towers 2006 - Mine Train - 6 taken to hospital - Continues to operate
Blackpool 2009 - Big Dipper - 21 taken to hospital - Continues to operate
Blackpool 2000 - Big One - 21 taken to hospital - Continues to operate

There are also plenty of travelling fairgrounds operating rides that will require insurance and I am sure they are much more likely to have incidents than a static ride which has been operating without a major problem in 59 years.

So I don't buy the excuse that wild mouse could not be insured.

What is very very clear is that BPB didn't want to close the ride, so I refuse to given them a hard time over it. However the way it was done I take great exception to.

PB will always claim that they didn't want the ride to close. They can't get away with saying anything else but I think we can assume that someone at the very top wanted the ride closed !