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Cariba Additions?

It's a shame that when they built the waterpark they didn't leave room for expansion. Splash Landing encloses 2 sides, the conference centre on anouther and the outdoor area blocks an indoor expansion (which is what is really needed). If they could find a way to expand behind the crazy golf they'd have a real opportunity to make something special.
 
Demolish the outdoor area and expand the whole water park out towards the hotel rooms and the service road. Done right there is plenty of room for expansion. Could even keep the external pools and add more slides on top of them.

Satalite view on Google Maps seems to show the area as being almost as big as the waterpark itself https://goo.gl/maps/8pgiUsvF6Ux
 
Sorry to bump this thread yet again, but I am currently at Center Parcs Longleat. Their waterpark is really nice, especially with the two new additions. Their two new additions made me think... why aren't Merlin even remotely worried that two huge new waterslides have sprung up in Longleat and they haven't got anything to counter them? I reckon that some big slides like Tropical Cyclone and Typhoon would really raise visitor numbers to the waterpark. Merlin could even do a big marketing campaign on national television. They could even get a ProSlide Skybox, like Ihu's Breakaway Falls at Aquatica. That would even give them the USP of the UK's first drop pod slide. Come on, Merlin. If any executive from Alton Towers or Merlin is reading this, then please install a new slide in the waterpark. Anything is good.
 
Sorry for double posting, but I just wanted to ask: what actually is there in the outdoor section of the Waterpark other than Flash Floods and the big jacuzzi? I haven't visited the waterpark since 2009, so my memory of it is quite foggy.
 
At the risk of repeating a conversation @jon81uk and I had a few months years ago, my personal view is that Merlin (for now) see Cariba very much a supplementary part of the resort and not a key draw, whereas the Center Parcs waterparks are very much integral to what they offer (I wouldn't visit if it was closed - would you?). I broadly agree this is the correct way to position it, and certainly so before Alton really ramp up their efforts to be a year-round resort.

This position may change and we may see further investment in the waterpark, particularly with the focus on accommodation that is planned, the easiest way to get year-round revenue up on that front is to better exploit the waterpark and I think that's a tough sell with the current scale of the offering.

Great Wolf, Kalahari etc have done a hotel/waterpark hybrid with some success in the US market but they are very different businesses. I think Alton's biggest battle is convincing people to come out to the resort when the major coasters are closed, or booking to come weeks/months advance when some signature attractions are open but that it could be a total washout. Having a large-scale waterpark to fall back on could be a powerful marketing tool, but there are downsides of doing that too.

A day visit to a waterpark is probably going to be satisfied by Water World, Sandcastle or similar for the local market and other more distant metro areas have something equivalent to Cariba not too far away. For Merlin, I suspect the day visit waterpark market is not something that they are interested in chasing - people typically turn up, spend little more than the gate price and leave. Plus, it makes the facility far less exclusive for resort guests, which is a key selling point for them.
 
Rick said:
At the risk of repeating a conversation @jon81uk and I had a few months years ago, my personal view is that Merlin (for now) see Cariba very much a supplementary part of the resort and not a key draw, whereas the Center Parcs waterparks are very much integral to what they offer (I wouldn't visit if it was closed - would you?). I broadly agree this is the correct way to position it, and certainly so before Alton really ramp up their efforts to be a year-round resort.

This position may change and we may see further investment in the waterpark, particularly with the focus on accommodation that is planned, the easiest way to get year-round revenue up on that front is to better exploit the waterpark and I think that's a tough sell with the current scale of the offering.

Great Wolf, Kalahari etc have done a hotel/waterpark hybrid with some success in the US market but they are very different businesses. I think Alton's biggest battle is convincing people to come out to the resort when the major coasters are closed, or booking to come weeks/months advance when some signature attractions are open but that it could be a total washout. Having a large-scale waterpark to fall back on could be a powerful marketing tool, but there are downsides of doing that too.

A day visit to a waterpark is probably going to be satisfied by Water World, Sandcastle or similar for the local market and other more distant metro areas have something equivalent to Cariba not too far away. For Merlin, I suspect the day visit waterpark market is not something that they are interested in chasing - people typically turn up, spend little more than the gate price and leave. Plus, it makes the facility far less exclusive for resort guests, which is a key selling point for them.
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I suppose that I do, like many other members of the public do, currently see the theme park as Alton Towers' main attraction and the Waterpark as a mere side attraction. I was more thinking that Alton's waterpark is going to drown (pun intended) in the wave pool of UK water parks if they don't build something new soon. I was also thinking that recurring guests who frequently visit will get bored after a while if they don't build something new. Also, new additions would make the waterpark more able to cope with the large crowds staying at the Resort's ever increasing accommodation lineup. Although I suppose, in Merlin's defence, that they don't really need to invest in the Waterpark as long as it is still a side attraction so to speak.
 
There certainly seems to be no interest in expanding the waterpark so that it can be marketed more to day visitors, but I'd say it could do with expansion in order to deal with what demand there already is. I've seen it get pretty packed sometimes when I've been there, and if they add more and more accommodation and start to actually keep it all open all season, that isn't going to help the waterpark to cope.
 
Another curiosity is that the waterpark doesn't have its own external entrance, which makes it hard to navigate for first time visitors. It was originally exclusive to hotel guests, now that its been opened up to the general public it has to deal with a lot more people than was ever intended.

I’ve looked on recent TripAdviser reviews and taken a few quote from a few peoples feedback:

"There were far too many people in there… couldn't enjoy it as too packed."

"Having been to other water parks in the UK I feel Alton towers should be head and shoulders above the rest. No extreme rides, bowls or anything to get the pulse racing. I'd go back to Blackpool or butlins before I came here again."

"To be honest was very disappointed nothing had changed and thought the rides need to now be updated."

The problem is they seem to be getting people through doors but not leaving everyone with a positive impression.
 
AstroDan said:
The water park is a cash cow.

It gets rafts of guests, even though nothing ever changes.
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Albeit this is mainly dictated by its woeful capacity.

The point about it being a 'cash cow' is entirely correct, though. Why would Merlin invest extra capital if it wouldn't make any difference to visitation? The company have already stated numerous times that they only invest Capex into things that, in theory, increase visitation (this obviously hasn't worked perfectly as they'd have liked with some recent additions, however).
 
WickerManiac said:
Albeit this is mainly dictated by its woeful capacity.

The point about it being a 'cash cow' is entirely correct, though. Why would Merlin invest extra capital if it wouldn't make any difference to visitation? The company have already stated numerous times that they only invest Capex into things that, in theory, increase visitation (this obviously hasn't worked perfectly as they'd have liked with some recent additions, however).
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Yep and adding one new slide would market it as something new, but then increase visitation and guest satisfaction would go down as the queues are still too long. They would need to significantly increase capacity, adding 4+ new slides of varying types and lengths. For every headline attraction (like Masterblaster) there needs to be 2 crowd soaking attractions such as Rush & Rampage.

Matt N said:
Sorry for double posting, but I just wanted to ask: what actually is there in the outdoor section of the Waterpark other than Flash Floods and the big jacuzzi? I haven't visited the waterpark since 2009, so my memory of it is quite foggy.
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All that is outdoors are the five Flash Floods slides, the pool they land into, some more regular pool attached to that (and an exit from the water back inside) plus the jacuzzi and an indoor exit from that too.
 
To be fair, they have added a new slide recently, or since I last visited anyway, but it was closed both days we were in the water park :)
 
IanB said:
To be fair, they have added a new slide recently, or since I last visited anyway, but it was closed both days we were in the water park :)
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The one underneath the wacky waterworks?
That is a minor upgrade to the existing structure, not really a new addition.
 
jon81uk said:
Yep and adding one new slide would market it as something new, but then increase visitation and guest satisfaction would go down as the queues are still too long. They would need to significantly increase capacity, adding 4+ new slides of varying types and lengths. For every headline attraction (like Masterblaster) there needs to be 2 crowd soaking attractions such as Rush & Rampage.


All that is outdoors are the five Flash Floods slides, the pool they land into, some more regular pool attached to that (and an exit from the water back inside) plus the jacuzzi and an indoor exit from that too.
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I think you're missing the point. It IS already at capacity almost all year-round, due to its relatively low capacity. So new additions wouldn't increase visitation or footfall.
 
WickerManiac said:
I think you're missing the point. It IS already at capacity almost all year-round, due to its relatively low capacity. So new additions wouldn't increase visitation or footfall.
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No that is my point, it is at capacity, so adding a new slide that will make more people want to visit will just make it worse. If they add one big headline slide (such as a big funnel one) they would also need to add 2 more simple slides just to cope with the people coming to ride the new headliner.
I agree with you it is already at capcity, so adding new headline attractions won't increase capacity as there will just be more guests coming to ride the new slide, making the existing ones worse.
If currently it can cope with 500 guests an hour (hypothetical) and a new slide means they can get another 100 an hour, but then the marketing and word of mouth about the new addition might get them 200 more guests, so they waterpark overall is now at a worse overcapacity situation than before they added anything!

To some extent the theme park has the same issues, constantly adding new coasters without adding smaller support attractions is not a good way to go.
 
WickerManiac said:
The point about it being a 'cash cow' is entirely correct, though. Why would Merlin invest extra capital if it wouldn't make any difference to visitation? The company have already stated numerous times that they only invest Capex into things that, in theory, increase visitation (this obviously hasn't worked perfectly as they'd have liked with some recent additions, however).
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As paying guests, all that concerns us is what we want and would keep us visiting. If people want something new, then that's valid. If a sizeable enough amount of people want something new, or less crowds (better capacity) and would return visit /visit more often with a waterpark expansion, then that's solid reason to invest.

I know you were just (correctly) explaining their perspective, but just to add - we (or any paying guests) shouldn't change our demand just to second guess Merlin's internal capital strategies. That's none of our business technically, it's customer demand on the whole that matters. :)
 
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As someone else already pointed out, Cariba Creek has no formal entrance of its own. It was never intended to be open to the general public, it was designed and intended for hotel guests only.

The people who designed it knew what they were doing. Merlin are clueless, and changed the business model of Alton Towers generally speaking. Therefore the waterpark will likely never expand.

It would make more sense to build a whole new waterpark complex IF Alton Towers ever open a full entertainment/shopping/dining resort area like Univsal Citywalk or Disney Springs. Very unlikely.
 
If you look at satellite view they could essentially double the inside portion of the waterpark by removing the outdoor section and expanding the indoor space. It wouldn't be a great loss (aside from the hot tub area) as they rarely open as it is.

If they left the did expand that area, they could then utilise the service road in-between Splash and the Golf (expanding it to meet the monorail) and make it a pathway to a proper entrance. Or more difficult due to the service area even try to meet under the slides between Splash and the Conference entrance.

There are sensible options if AT ever wanted to develop it, but it frequently sells out despite minimal innovation and increased prices.
 
I think it would do the waterpark a favour if Merlin put less emphasis on the word waterpark in their marketing, sort of like Center Parcs does with its Subtropical Swimming Paradises. If they don't expand it, that is.
 
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