Coronavirus

[BigT]

I mean, that very page refers to paid and voluntary roles lol

Not for people doing the jabbing it don’t, those roles are paid.
I for one am happy they are, I’m just pointing out the fact it’s not volunteering if you are getting paid.

 

[James]

Staff I work with have been approached to be vaccinators (all staff who act as the flu champions have been approached so far). The training and administering the vaccination has to be done in their own time with no pay. Unlike the flu vaccination they are unable to fit this during their work shifts either due to the requirement to attend designated venues for Covid-19 vaccinations.

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[Craig]

The NHS allow registered clinicians in management roles to volunteer their time to give vaccinations:

Recruitment and redeployment of existing NHS people is being coordinated locally. Please look out for information from your employing organisation and your local system COVID-19 vaccination team.

If you are a registered clinician in a management role and would like to volunteer some of your time directly to the vaccination effort, please contact the HR team at your nearest NHS trust or your local COVID-19 vaccination team.

 

[Dave]

Volunteered? I was under the impression vaccinators got paid.

https://www.england.nhs.uk/coronavirus/join-the-nhs-covid-19-vaccine-team/

To volunteer to do something doesn’t necessarily mean you are not paid. No NHS member of staff is been press ganged into vaccinating as obviously we are also doing our day jobs (the frontline NHS stuff). So you volunteer to work extra shifts in the vaccination centres but yes it is paid.

I believe some of the support roles are being staffed by unpaid volunteers though.

Staff I work with have been approached to be vaccinators (all staff who act as the flu champions have been approached so far). The training and administering the vaccination has to be done in their own time with no pay. Unlike the flu vaccination they are unable to fit this during their work shifts either due to the requirement to attend designated venues for Covid-19 vaccinations.

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If these people are working under AfC they should be paid in line with those T&C’s. The NHS isn’t expecting staff to work for free. People can choose to volunteer their time I believe though it isn’t expected.

 

[Islander]

I have to say, I'm getting really sick of constant posts (on social media, not necessarily here) and news stories about the lockdown now, and whether it's strict enough etc. It's been imposed, we're in it, and genuinely what could be tweaked to make it stricter?

All this discussion on multiple channels just leads to huge anxiety and worrying for a not-insignificant proportion of the public. I personally hate it - the logical thing is to take a break from social media, and I would... but that's particularly difficult in a lockdown where outside of work there is very little more I can do lol.

I think it is fair to say this lockdown isn't as harsh as the first in April onwards last year. But what would be done differently?

• Schools: I think this is the big one. During the first lockdown, schools were closed except to children of key workers, which led to most schools supposedly seeing around 10% of their cohorts in person. Now that figure has allegedly risen to around 40% - why? What's changed? To my mind, this is the only real place that restrictions could and should be scrutinised, and potentially tightened up.

• Work: there was a misconception during the first lockdown that only key workers were permitted to work - that was not true, everyone was told to work from home where possible, but where it wasn't possible, working at company premises was permitted. That restriction (if it is a restriction) is the same now. There were, I guess, stricter restrictions last year on what work couldn't be conducted, for example construction sites had to close, but other than that I think the greatest difference is that many more companies chose to make use of the Furlough scheme than are doing so now. Do we want to be increasing the country's already insane covid-related debt even further? There is also a big change in behaviour at work between first and this lockdowns - there was no such thing as a 'covid-secure' workplace back in April-May last year, whereas now there is.

• Recreation: in first lockdown, you were permitted to exercise outdoors once a day, locally, on your own, for 1h max. Now, you can exercise outdoors once a day, locally, on your own or with your bubble, or with one other adult, with no maximum time. I can't believe reducing the max time back to 1h will make much/any difference (besides, I imagine the much colder weather does a lot to regulate time outside anyway!). Maybe allowing people to meet with one other is a bad idea? I don't know... it clearly won't help, but I can't imagine it's a massive vector for virus transmission.

• Worship: First lockdown, no group worship. This lockdown, it's allowed. This does surprise me, though I do understand the importance to the mental wellbeing of some. Though having said that, meeting with friends for general socialising, rather than specifically worship, would be extremely beneficial to many, yet of course that's rightly off the table, so maybe this should be for the moment as well?

• Shopping: There is definitely a slight increase in what stores are allowed to open, and maybe that should be looked at. I think what should definitely also be considered is a stricter enforcement on shopping alone, but by who? Not fair really to put that responsibility onto shop workers.

Having listed it out like that, I guess there are in fairness a few 'tweaks' that could be made to the current restrictions to improve them - mainly in schools I think. But they are tweaks, as opposed to full-on lockdown-reforms.

I think people (and more pertinently the media) need to realise that there is only so much people's lives can be restricted, even in a national/international crisis, before far more damage is done than the benefits gained from such action. I think it's also sad that so many media outlets, and indeed individuals, need to concentrate on negatives and dwell on how and why things won't work, and will get worse. How does that help anyone?

Now, excuse me while I go curl up on bed, and contemplate repeatedly how life may possibly get more and more unbearable over the coming weeks.

 

[Vik]

I have to say, I'm getting really sick of constant posts (on social media, not necessarily here) and news stories about the lockdown now, and whether it's strict enough etc. It's been imposed, we're in it, and genuinely what could be tweaked to make it stricter?

]

• Work: there was a misconception during the first lockdown that only key workers were permitted to work - that was not true, everyone was told to work from home where possible, but where it wasn't possible, working at company premises was permitted. That restriction (if it is a restriction) is the same now. There were, I guess, stricter restrictions last year on what work couldn't be conducted, for example construction sites had to close, but other than that I think the greatest difference is that many more companies chose to make use of the Furlough scheme than are doing so now. Do we want to be increasing the country's already insane covid-related debt even further? There is also a big change in behaviour at work between first and this lockdowns - there was no such thing as a 'covid-secure' workplace back in April-May last year, whereas now there is.

• Recreation: in first lockdown, you were permitted to exercise outdoors once a day, locally, on your own, for 1h max. Now, you can exercise outdoors once a day, locally, on your own or with your bubble, or with one other adult, with no maximum time. I can't believe reducing the max time back to 1h will make much/any difference (besides, I imagine the much colder weather does a lot to regulate time outside anyway!). Maybe allowing people to meet with one other is a bad idea? I don't know... it clearly won't help, but I can't imagine it's a massive vector for virus transmission.

Now, excuse me while I go curl up on bed, and contemplate repeatedly how life may possibly get more and more unbearable over the coming weeks.

In terms of recreation in the first lockdown, there was not actually a limit of 1 hour. This only became a thing when Michael Gove was pushed to suggest a limit on one of the breakfast shows (which one I do not recall), and he suggested one hour for walking and 30 mins for cycling. However this was never in any guidance, which suggested once a day. The actual law was even less strict where no limit was mentioned in regards to the number of times you could leave your home. Sadly the one hour thing still persists now. I seen a video on Youtube yesterday of a woman arrested for breaching Covid restrictions, (not sure where it was) and the Police officer saying that she had been seen outside for more than an hour.

The misconception around only key workers are allowed to go to work seems to still continue now. People seem genuinely surprised that I am going to work, suggesting that surely that's illegal? I have to point out to them that we are allowed to go to work if we can't work from home regardless of if we are a key worker or not. It would be rather difficult to do my job from home.

I'm also contemplating how much life could get more unbearable of the next few weeks. Especially when you read scare stories how experts are calling for a China style lockdown. I'd normally do something like that over a beer in a nice pub somewhere, but alas, I can't so I will eat a large bar of chocolate instead.

 

[BigT]

I have to say, I'm getting really sick of constant posts (on social media, not necessarily here) and news stories about the lockdown now, and whether it's strict enough etc. It's been imposed, we're in it, and genuinely what could be tweaked to make it stricter?

All this discussion on multiple channels just leads to huge anxiety and worrying for a not-insignificant proportion of the public. I personally hate it - the logical thing is to take a break from social media, and I would... but that's particularly difficult in a lockdown where outside of work there is very little more I can do lol.

I think it is fair to say this lockdown isn't as harsh as the first in April onwards last year. But what would be done differently?

• Schools: I think this is the big one. During the first lockdown, schools were closed except to children of key workers, which led to most schools supposedly seeing around 10% of their cohorts in person. Now that figure has allegedly risen to around 40% - why? What's changed? To my mind, this is the only real place that restrictions could and should be scrutinised, and potentially tightened up.

• Work: there was a misconception during the first lockdown that only key workers were permitted to work - that was not true, everyone was told to work from home where possible, but where it wasn't possible, working at company premises was permitted. That restriction (if it is a restriction) is the same now. There were, I guess, stricter restrictions last year on what work couldn't be conducted, for example construction sites had to close, but other than that I think the greatest difference is that many more companies chose to make use of the Furlough scheme than are doing so now. Do we want to be increasing the country's already insane covid-related debt even further? There is also a big change in behaviour at work between first and this lockdowns - there was no such thing as a 'covid-secure' workplace back in April-May last year, whereas now there is.

• Recreation: in first lockdown, you were permitted to exercise outdoors once a day, locally, on your own, for 1h max. Now, you can exercise outdoors once a day, locally, on your own or with your bubble, or with one other adult, with no maximum time. I can't believe reducing the max time back to 1h will make much/any difference (besides, I imagine the much colder weather does a lot to regulate time outside anyway!). Maybe allowing people to meet with one other is a bad idea? I don't know... it clearly won't help, but I can't imagine it's a massive vector for virus transmission.

• Worship: First lockdown, no group worship. This lockdown, it's allowed. This does surprise me, though I do understand the importance to the mental wellbeing of some. Though having said that, meeting with friends for general socialising, rather than specifically worship, would be extremely beneficial to many, yet of course that's rightly off the table, so maybe this should be for the moment as well?

• Shopping: There is definitely a slight increase in what stores are allowed to open, and maybe that should be looked at. I think what should definitely also be considered is a stricter enforcement on shopping alone, but by who? Not fair really to put that responsibility onto shop workers.

Having listed it out like that, I guess there are in fairness a few 'tweaks' that could be made to the current restrictions to improve them - mainly in schools I think. But they are tweaks, as opposed to full-on lockdown-reforms.

I think people (and more pertinently the media) need to realise that there is only so much people's lives can be restricted, even in a national/international crisis, before far more damage is done than the benefits gained from such action. I think it's also sad that so many media outlets, and indeed individuals, need to concentrate on negatives and dwell on how and why things won't work, and will get worse. How does that help anyone?

Now, excuse me while I go curl up on bed, and contemplate repeatedly how life may possibly get more and more unbearable over the coming weeks.

A good post and I agree with all of it.
On schools I agree more children are in school this time, I think that’s down to the fact that those that can’t study at home are told now they have to go in, that’s a good thing and goes some way to counter the ridiculous decision to give in to the teaching unions.
My opinion is all children should be in school, it’s what they do out of school that causes more problems with the spread.
On work again the misconception is that you are legally bound to work from home, in March little was known about COVID-19 so there was a big panic and most workplaces closed including McDonalds etc. Now work places are more COVID secure so a lot of bosses are insisting employees still attend work as mine is, most have literally spent thousands so I don’t blame them.
Worship should be closed, if I can’t meet my friends for a beer in the pub how can churches and the like still be open? Worship is just socialising by another name.
Shopping is a strange one, who makes up these what’s essential and what isn’t? It’s a strange world when alcohol is essential but clothes and shoes aren’t.

I said from the outset that this lockdown won’t be adhered to like the first one, people where genuinely scared in April but not anymore, they can see that whilst not a hoax it is daily being over egged by the media and politicians.
The police are trying to enforce non existent hastily made up laws like travel restrictions, several doctors and nurses everyday telling us they can’t cope but at the same time “volunteering” to do overtime vaccinating, cases going through the roof despite the fact most of the country has been in lockdown since October, then we come to that pointless piece of cloth on the front of your face that in most cases has not been tested or made to any standard.

 

[MattyH]

I'm not sure I know of any churches still doing group worship, the ones I'm aware of have gone back to virutal services

 

[Jonathan]

I'm not sure I know of any churches still doing group worship, the ones I'm aware of have gone back to virutal services

Mine went back to virtual services when we moved into Tier 3, and a letter's gone round from the chair of the Chester & Stoke-on-Trent Methodist District strongly recommending that churches close until further notice. Just because they can open at the moment doesn't mean they should.

 

[Thameslink Rail]

The only places of worship I have seen open have been for private prayer and have been virtually empty anyway.

 

[D4n]

On schools I agree more children are in school this time, I think that’s down to the fact that those that can’t study at home are told now they have to go in, that’s a good thing and goes some way to counter the ridiculous decision to give in to the teaching unions.

My opinion is all children should be in school, it’s what they do out of school that causes more problems with the spread.

The police are trying to enforce non existent haseveral doctors and nurses everyday telling us they can’t cope but at the same time “volunteering” to do overtime vaccinating

The contempt you show for all those being significantly exposed to the virus in order to carry out essential work is incredible.

 

[Jonathan]

The only places of worship I have seen open have been for private prayer and have been virtually empty anyway.

Goes to show that the vast majority of places of worship seem to be taking it seriously. There'll always be the odd one that doesn't, but I'm certain they're in an incredibly small minority.

 

[BigT]

The contempt you show for all those being significantly exposed to the virus in order to carry out essential work is incredible.

No I just don’t think a special exemption should be made for teachers, what if other key workers took the same attitude?

 

[Islander]

Generally, I'm very much on the side of the Police and government, but this article makes for some... interesting reading:

Covid: Women on exercise trip 'surrounded by police'

Two women have described how they were surrounded by police, read their rights and fined £200 each after driving five miles to take a walk.

The women were also told the hot drinks they had brought along were not allowed as they were "classed as a picnic".

Guidance for the current lockdown says people can travel for exercise as long as it is in their "local area".

The police force involved, Derbyshire Police, said driving for exercise was "not in the spirit" of lockdown.

One of the would-be walkers, Jessica Allen, assumed "someone had been murdered" when she arrived at Foremark Reservoir on Wednesday afternoon.

Foremark Reservoir is five miles away from where Jessica Allen and Eliza Moore live
"As we drove in there was a police van, a police car, and there were loads of police there," said Ms Allen, who lives in Ashby-de-la-Zouch in Leicestershire.

"I genuinely thought someone had been murdered; the place is normally so quiet. The next thing, my car is surrounded. I got out of my car thinking 'There's no way they're coming to speak to us'. Straight away they start questioning us.

"One of them started reading my rights and I was looking at my friend thinking 'This must be a joke'.

"I said we had come in separate cars, even parked two spaces away and even brought our own drinks with us. He said 'You can't do that as it's classed as a picnic'."

Her friend, Eliza Moore, said she was "stunned at the time" so did not challenge police and gave her details so they could send a fixed penalty notice.

"Just seeing a police officer anyway is quite scary for some people and we were really not expecting to be approached and to be told we were doing something wrong," she said.

"We don't want to get away with it if we have broken the rule, but it seems a bit unfair that you can be fined on something that's so vague."

How far can you travel for exercise?

Guidance issued by the Cabinet Office states that people can leave their homes for exercise but should not travel outside their "local area".

However, the actual legislation does not specify a maximum distance that people are allowed to travel for exercise.

Both the guidance and legislation state people can exercise with one other person, as Jessica Allen and Eliza Moore did.

Human rights barrister Adam Wagner said: "There is no law against travelling to exercise. The guidance is not legally binding and the police have no power to enforce it unless it is reflected in the lockdown regulations which in this case it is not."

Derbyshire Police said: "It is up to each individual officer on a case-by-case basis to decide what is reasonable as the legislation does not proscribe a distance."

The BBC contacted the Cabinet Office, Home Office, College of Policing and National Police Chiefs' Council to ask for clarification over what they define as "local area" in relation to exercise. None could clarify this.

However, the College of Policing said: "In overall terms police officers across England and Wales will be using their discretion and professional judgement about whether or not someone has a reasonable excuse for travelling for exercise and being outside the place where they are living."

Jessica Allen (right) said walking at the reservoir benefits her mental health during lockdown
Ms Allen said she is taking the pandemic "very seriously" as her brother is a doctor working on a Covid ward in London, and her parents have both had coronavirus.

She said she drove to the reservoir as she knew it would be less crowded than near her house.

"I'm self-employed but my business is closed and I'm trying to fill my time," she said.

"I suffer from anxiety and when you go by the water you feel so much better. The only thing I've got to look forward to is planning a walk with my friend."

Ms Allen said the experience was "very intimidating" and had left her feeling scared of police in general.

"I was so shook up afterwards," she said. "The fact they read my rights. I thought 'Am I going to prison for going on a walk?'

"I'm not a criminal but we were treated as if we were criminals and it really made me feel for those people who are wrongly arrested and questioned by police, because it wasn't a nice situation to be in."


Jessica Allen, whose brother is a doctor on a Covid ward, went to the reservoir as she knew it would be quiet

Derbyshire Police said in a statement: "Driving to a location - where exercise could easily have been taken closer to a person's home - is clearly not in the spirit of the national effort to reduce our travel, reduce the possible spread of the disease and reduce the number of deaths.

"Each officer will use their professional judgement on a case-by-case basis, however, people should expect to be challenged and understand the clear reasons why they may be asked about their movements given the critical situation the NHS currently finds itself in."

Andrew Bridgen, MP for North West Leicestershire, said he regarded the reservoir as a local area.

He tweeted: "I'm concerned that my constituents are facing fines from Derbyshire Police for taking exercise in what I would class as the local area.

"It is important that common sense is used when enforcing guidelines, and a fine rather than issuing guidance appears to be rather over zealous."

Derbyshire Police has also been giving fixed penalty notices to people who visit Calke Abbey and Elvaston Castle.

Fixed penalty notices have been given to people who visit Calke Abbey, a National Trust property
One man said his parents were given a fixed penalty notice after driving seven miles to Calke Abbey from their home in Whitwick, Leicestershire.

"Upon approaching the park there was a team of police officers so my parents decided to pull in and check that no laws were being broken," he said.

"Immediately they were hit with a £200 fine. When my parents said that they weren't aware this was too far and they'd go home immediately, the police officer simply said 'It's too late'."

Guidance from the College of Policing says officers should follow the "Four Es" and only give fixed penalty notices as a last resort.

When asked about this, Derbyshire Police said: "The four Es are still in use, however, where there are cases of blatant breaches of the regulations then fines will be issued by officers."

During the first lockdown, the force was criticised for releasing drone footage of people walking in the Peak District.

Speaking at the time, Lord Sumption - a former Supreme Court judge - said it was "disgraceful" and "shamed our policing traditions".

 

[delta79]

I believe some of the support roles are being staffed by unpaid volunteers though.

St John are doing support roles. One of theses is keeping an eye on the 15 min wait after injection.

Schools: I think this is the big one. During the first lockdown, schools were closed except to children of key workers, which led to most schools supposedly seeing around 10% of their cohorts in person. Now that figure has allegedly risen to around 40% - why? What's changed? To my mind, this is the only real place that restrictions could and should be scrutinised, and potentially tightened up.

Its key workers children and vulnerable students.
They have now classified not being able to access online teaching as part of vulnerable students

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[Dave]

A good post and I agree with all of it.
On schools I agree more children are in school this time, I think that’s down to the fact that those that can’t study at home are told now they have to go in, that’s a good thing and goes some way to counter the ridiculous decision to give in to the teaching unions.
My opinion is all children should be in school, it’s what they do out of school that causes more problems with the spread.
On work again the misconception is that you are legally bound to work from home, in March little was known about COVID-19 so there was a big panic and most workplaces closed including McDonalds etc. Now work places are more COVID secure so a lot of bosses are insisting employees still attend work as mine is, most have literally spent thousands so I don’t blame them.
Worship should be closed, if I can’t meet my friends for a beer in the pub how can churches and the like still be open? Worship is just socialising by another name.
Shopping is a strange one, who makes up these what’s essential and what isn’t? It’s a strange world when alcohol is essential but clothes and shoes aren’t.

I said from the outset that this lockdown won’t be adhered to like the first one, people where genuinely scared in April but not anymore, they can see that whilst not a hoax it is daily being over egged by the media and politicians.
The police are trying to enforce non existent hastily made up laws like travel restrictions, several doctors and nurses everyday telling us they can’t cope but at the same time “volunteering” to do overtime vaccinating, cases going through the roof despite the fact most of the country has been in lockdown since October, then we come to that pointless piece of cloth on the front of your face that in most cases has not been tested or made to any standard.

I can’t decide if you are being a deliberate troll or not.

1) Scientist said the schools were a viral vector, the government didn’t make the decision based on unions and the unions only asked for the schools to close because the scientist said they should.

2) The NHS has lots of different staff and services, the staff in the acute areas are not volunteering to go to the vaccination centres. It’s people in the non-acute services volunteering, or people where the acute shifts are filled and want to help out with expansion of the vaccine programme. I work in a mixed acute/ non acute service but as we are not primarily an area that deals with lung disease (more neuro/ vascular and MSK in the acute setting) our demand is massively fluctuating (because when the hospital is full of Covid we see a drop in demand, when the wave of patients then develop post Covid complications we get busy). The shortest vaccine shift is 4hrs and you only commit to a week in advance if you want, so it’s hardly out of the realm of possibility to manage your workload if you are in this situation. Obviously ITU nurses are not volunteering (and it’s a very niche and skilled role so you can’t just move a random nurse into it, you can however easily learn to vaccinate). You then have the retired staff who are volunteering, or those who have moved into management (despite what the press say most NHS managers are clinically trained).

3) Masks worn correctly have been scientifically proven to reduce viral load so reducing transmission. This isn’t a hunch or an opinion, it’s a fact. It doesn’t completely stop transmission but it reduces risk.

I do agree with you that religious venues should be closed excluding small funerals.

 

[Dave]

Sorry double post but...

I’m not a football fan but a match report was on the tv today and what surprised me was everyone on the pitch, from the footballers to the managers/ staff. Not one showed any restraint in hugging and talking in each other’s faces. Now I know when playing the footballers can’t exactly maintain social distancing but surely if only for role model sake they should be doing so before and after the match, and the managers should be doing it all the time?

 

[BigT]

I’m sorry you feel that way Dave, my posts often disagree with the general view point on here, if that makes me a troll then I plead guilty.
It would be boring if we all agreed and quite frankly debate wouldn’t go very far, I don’t take it personally.

Now on schools was it not the unions that told teachers not to attend their job as employees on the first day of term? Scientists have been proven wrong many times during this pandemic, it’s the governments job to govern not scientists whether you agree with them or not, the government are democratically elected and can be removed by the public, personally I feel we have heard too much from unelected scientists.
I don’t blame teachers here, they are lions led by donkeys in the unions, why are pre schools open as normal? I’d suggest the likelihood is they are even less safe than high schools, very young children are unlikely to social distance but their employees are largely not unionised and vast majority are private enterprises.

Your point on hospitals is fair enough, I like many am just getting a little fed up of being dictated too on a daily basis about stay at home by people who are not taking a financial hit even in the slightest, it’s starting to come across a bit rich now, yes pressure is on hospitals like always this time of year but there are many many more times the number of people in hospitals suffering as well.

On masks I agree there is a small benefit to wearing a tested and regulated mask with a proven standard mark printed on it, not many of the masks being worn are this type though so I’d question the point of wearing what is essentially a piece of cloth over your face masquerading to being a face mask.

 

[Danza91]

The 'key worker' definition is too broad and defeats the point of closing schools if 40-50% of kids are in. As someone who works on the EFL and within sports news even I'd probably fall into that category now!

Driving to and from work yesterday (cannot do my freelance work from home) the roads seemed just as busy as pre-lockdown, arguably even busier. I did not believe all these people are working/making essential journeys too so I wondered where on earth there are going. I can only conclude that public mood has now clearly shifted, especially with the Clap for Heroes thankfully falling flat on its arse on Thursday.

Maybe the nation has finally woken up that the NHS has been massively underfunded and mismanaged for over a decade now, and it deserves being properly funded? The lies, lack of humility, and constant u-turns from the Government has now led to people to just ignoring whatever they say? And when Whitty stands there saying restrictions may need to be brought in again next winter, all while there is currently no roadmap out of this lockdown, what is the point?

I feel if we had a roadmap out of this, so plans for the future can be made with more confidence, it would result in the public following the rules of this lockdown more. Instead, we'll get Captain Tom wheeled out.

 

[Dave]

I’m sorry you feel that way Dave, my posts often disagree with the general view point on here, if that makes me a troll then I plead guilty.
It would be boring if we all agreed and quite frankly debate wouldn’t go very far, I don’t take it personally.

Now on schools was it not the unions that told teachers not to attend their job as employees on the first day of term? Scientists have been proven wrong many times during this pandemic, it’s the governments job to govern not scientists whether you agree with them or not, the government are democratically elected and can be removed by the public, personally I feel we have heard too much from unelected scientists.
I don’t blame teachers here, they are lions led by donkeys in the unions, why are pre schools open as normal? I’d suggest the likelihood is they are even less safe than high schools, very young children are unlikely to social distance but their employees are largely not unionised and vast majority are private enterprises.

Your point on hospitals is fair enough, I like many am just getting a little fed up of being dictated too on a daily basis about stay at home by people who are not taking a financial hit even in the slightest, it’s starting to come across a bit rich now, yes pressure is on hospitals like always this time of year but there are many many more times the number of people in hospitals suffering as well.

On masks I agree there is a small benefit to wearing a tested and regulated mask with a proven standard mark printed on it, not many of the masks being worn are this type though so I’d question the point of wearing what is essentially a piece of cloth over your face masquerading to being a face mask.

I never said you where, but you seem to take a contrary view at times without backing it up with evidence. Your points also often seem to come with an attack on a group of workers (teachers/ NHS) but maybe I’m just over reading it. I like a debate and believe strongly in people accepting that alternative opinions exist.

I can say that everyone is frustrated with the rules, including those who work in the NHS. It’s a regular conversation point at work. I can also say that I have experienced a lot of winters in the NHS and this is definitely the worst I have seen and at the moment our area is not in the worst hit regions in this third peak (it got the brunt in November however).

Personally I wish the government had better managed this, I also wish a decade of deliberate underfunding didn’t mean the NHS was already struggling prior to this pandemic. That said I think the UK will show a real strength with the vaccination programme thanks to our socialised health system and the contribution of the army.