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Coronavirus

Coronavirus - The Poll

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The term “Covid secure” for a workplace really winds me up. If you are indoors with other people in the same room then it’s not Covid secure. Unless you have all the Windows open and doors and good ventilation then it’s not Covid secure. Unless you each have your own bathroom facilities and kitchen then it’s not Covid secure. There is no such thing as a cocos secure workplace. Even doctors and nurses wearing full PPE are catching Covid. Best thing people can do is work from home if they are able to and enough of this Covid secure malarkey.
Maybe it should be called “Covid risk reduced” instead!
 
I’ve been thinking - what will happen once the initial vaccination programme is completely rolled out?

even if social distancing is scrapped and we return to pre covid , how will us the public react?
Will pubs continue with table only service ? Will people continue to wear masks?

I think the biggest thing I have missed is propping up a bar for a few hours after work on a Friday. Will this ever happen again?
 
GaryH said:
The term “Covid secure” for a workplace really winds me up. If you are indoors with other people in the same room then it’s not Covid secure. Unless you have all the Windows open and doors and good ventilation then it’s not Covid secure. Unless you each have your own bathroom facilities and kitchen then it’s not Covid secure. There is no such thing as a cocos secure workplace. Even doctors and nurses wearing full PPE are catching Covid. Best thing people can do is work from home if they are able to and enough of this Covid secure malarkey.
Maybe it should be called “Covid risk reduced” instead!
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I don't see shared bathrooms as any more of a risk than anything else, just try to ensure there is only one person in the room, or if large enough keep more than 2m apart and wear a mask. I think workplaces can reduce the risk right down, but some people choose not to do everything they can to lower their risks.

There are some things that cannot be done from home so of course some workplaces need to be open.

I do still think there are too many people going to shops to buy things they don't "need" our neighbour has been to The Range several times to get home furnishings.

Also I think there are a large number of people inviting friends/family into their homes still.
 
The problem with the figures is there is an inevitable delay between infection, hospitalisation and deaths. The high hospitalisation rates we're seeing now are the results of things that took place 2-3 weeks ago, i.e. over the Christmas and New Year period, when perhaps people were letting their guard down and mixing more than usual.

The impact of tier 4 and lockdown restrictions won't be evident for another week or two. It's difficult to know if they're working just by looking at the statistics in realtime. Perhaps the biggest concern though is hospitalisation rates are still rising, therefore we should expect deaths to keep rising in the coming weeks too.
 
I am gravely concerned for our hospitals. There are significant more people is hospital with Covid now than during the first peak last Srping (although not quite as many on mechanical ventilators, which probably shows how treatment has improved since then). Daily admissions keep rising, and daily case numbers are yet to fall (some signs of them flattening off in some areas which is positive).

It does appear that relative inaction following the short but successful November lockdown along with this new varient has allowed for hospitals to put in even more danger of being overwhelmed. I just hope it does not get to the point where doctors are having to make choices on who gets admitted/who gets the treatment they need.
 
Some hospital mortuaries are already at capacity, with Surrey using a temporary one in Leatherhead that's currently just over 20% full, and there are concerns that even this one could be filled in the coming weeks.

Source
 
jon81uk said:
I don't see shared bathrooms as any more of a risk than anything else, just try to ensure there is only one person in the room, or if large enough keep more than 2m apart and wear a mask. I think workplaces can reduce the risk right down.
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Quite a big risk actually. Covid has been found in poo, and has even been found to spread through sewer systems into peoples homes, although we are less at risk of this due to our U Bend plumbing which has a water seal in the bottom. Plus in many workplaces bathrooms are not very well ventilated, or there may be just one toilet in the room which is used by 20 or so people. If someone with Covid coughed into the air in the room, then someone went in shortly afterwards, chances are they could also contract the virus.

Granted not all bathroom facilites are the same but I dont think there are many which have windows to allow in fresh air.
 
Islander said:
Generally, I'm very much on the side of the Police and government, but this article makes for some... interesting reading:

Covid: Women on exercise trip 'surrounded by police'
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Some great compo faces there. I'm sure that one half of the story paints a full picture.

The police response to potential covid breaches, known as the 4 E's, is no secret and is published on the college of policing website. To summarise, you have to do something incredibly obviously stupid in the first place, or respond very badly to engagement, explanation and encouragement before enforcement happens.
 
pluk said:
Some great compo faces there. I'm sure that one half of the story paints a full picture.

The police response to potential covid breaches, known as the 4 E's, is no secret and is published on the college of policing website. To summarise, you have to do something incredibly obviously stupid in the first place, or respond very badly to engagement, explanation and encouragement before enforcement happens.
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Yes, and I’ve no doubt at all that generally that’s what’s happening. This article suggests, however, in a few isolated cases at least, it’s not. Doesn’t appear to have been much, if any, engagement, explanation or encouragement in this situation.


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GaryH said:
Quite a big risk actually. Covid has been found in poo, and has even been found to spread through sewer systems into peoples homes, although we are less at risk of this due to our U Bend plumbing which has a water seal in the bottom. Plus in many workplaces bathrooms are not very well ventilated, or there may be just one toilet in the room which is used by 20 or so people. If someone with Covid coughed into the air in the room, then someone went in shortly afterwards, chances are they could also contract the virus.

Granted not all bathroom facilites are the same but I dont think there are many which have windows to allow in fresh air.
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I agree on the ventilation, but surface transmission of Covid has not been found to be the main cause of any cases. As you wash your hands after using the toilet, the door handle on the way out might be a risk.

If everyone entering is wearing a mask and the ventilation is reasonable then the risk is probably reduced as low as possible if people are sensible and don't all enter the room at once. I'd worry more about situations where I am sharing the same room as people for more than 10 minutes.
 
Islander said:
Yes, and I’ve no doubt at all that generally that’s what’s happening. This article suggests, however, in a few isolated cases at least, it’s not. Doesn’t appear to have been much, if any, engagement, explanation or encouragement in this situation.


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Indeed, and it appears to be one force in particular, Derbyshire. The same police force who were pretty over the top when it came to shaming people back in the Spring! Sounds like they were also handing out FPNs to people visiting Calke Abbey, despite it clearly stating on the Government website that grounds of such places could remain open whether it was free to visit or not, and the obvious fact that you have to drive to get in there really.

Derbyshire police force have also said that they will be reviewing all FPNs issues in the new lockdown after receiving further guidance.
 
Islander said:
Yes, and I’ve no doubt at all that generally that’s what’s happening. This article suggests, however, in a few isolated cases at least, it’s not. Doesn’t appear to have been much, if any, engagement, explanation or encouragement in this situation.
Click to expand...

Of course the police, in their millions of interactions with the public every day, will make errors. I know I certainly have! But there is an established method of recourse if you are not in agreement with a penalty notice, and that is through the complaints and court system.

It is the inflammatory language used and clearly biased unchallenged account of the recipients of the tickets that I have a problem with. Rather than highlight areas of non essential travel and encouraging people to think about their actions it encourages challenge of the clear intent of the restrictions and enforcement of the law. It is undermining. Ultimately that is likely to be to the detriment of wider public health, I see it as very irresponsible reporting and lazy journalism.
 
So the government is finally on the verge of demanding that supermarkets and shops ban people with no face masks. No exceptions.

Is this the first bit of sense from this goverment finally?

I am sorry but this is a national health crysis, if you cant wear a mask you shouldnt be in public places like shops ect.

To many entitled people in this country. Half the reason is suspect why this second wave is so hard hitting. The virus doesnt discriminate and doesnt care about your mental health issues. Wear a mask or go home.
 
There’s a good argument right now that face masks don’t really do anything, just look at the daily case numbers.
I’d be a bit more sympathetic to the cause of wearing them if they actually had to be manufactured to some sort of standard.
Most of them aren’t.
 
If we all value our health, our lives and those all around us, then we all should be wearing a mask. Only those that have genuine medical reasons for not wearing one should not have to, but it should not be used as an excuse for those that can wear one. If you are not wearing one for medical reasons, then make sure you keep 2 meters apart, which is the length of an adult size bed not the length of your arm.

Scientifically it is proven that wearing a mask properly reduces the risk of transmission. They don't work because people are reusing them, sharing them, wearing them half hanging off their faces, keep touching them, putting them of and taking them off in a way which contaminates them etc.....
 
I must say, while I think the Conservatives response to this has been catastrophic in parts, I am impressed with the speed and seemingly the organisation of the vaccination rollout in the UK so far. Of course, this year is still going to be very unusual and we're far from the out the woods, but save for any rampaging new variation, I do think that we'll be able to see some kind of normal life return as the nights draw out and pressure on the NHS is reduced. Nonetheless, the next few months will be very painful.
 
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