Paultons Park: General Discussion

[jon81uk]

It wouldn't surprise me that after the success and "proof of concept" with Paultons' Ghostly Manor, we'll have Comcast/Universal commissioning an upscaled actual Luigi's Mansion version of this ride (with King Boo playing the role of OG and the rotating platform is a similar size to Efterling's Danse Macabre stage area).

Its rumoured/expected that Luigi's Mansion will be the next expansion for Epic Universe, so Universal will already have concepts for an attraction.

 

[owenstreet7]

It wouldn't surprise me that after the success and "proof of concept" with Paultons' Ghostly Manor, we'll have Comcast/Universal commissioning an upscaled actual Luigi's Mansion version of this ride (with King Boo playing the role of OG and the rotating platform is a similar size to Efterling's Danse Macabre stage area).

Universal seem to have quite a few Mack attractions at Epic Universe which could mean a Gameplay Theatre or some form of interactive dark ride based on Luigi's Mansion could be in the works

 

[tayspru]

Universal seem to have quite a few Mack attractions at Epic Universe which could mean a Gameplay Theatre or some form of interactive dark ride based on Luigi's Mansion could be in the works

I wouldn’t be surprised if Villain Con Minion Blast was a proof of concept for what would become a Luigi’s Mansion attraction

 

[Skyscraper]

Just a heads up for anyone who needs carer tickets, they're no longer free.

 

[Benzin]

Offt.

That's going to cause some outrage. Even if a number of places (theatre mostly) do it in a similar fashion.

 

[SuperMuscleMan]

I know it's not perfect but I can see why they charge, as paultons do limit capacity of the park making it a better experience for everyone. While I'd like to think that extra money will go towards better facilities for those who need carers. Like adult changing spaces, better ride access and rides that cater for people who need a career.

I myself find it odd that when I take my friend with Autism to a comic con I can get in free.

Although he's autistic im only needed in limited circumstances and in the more recent past I have paid full price for my ticket and gone under a disabled carers ticket (effectively I have 2 tickets). I cannot justify to-myself taking money from a small con for something that I would do to support my friend naturally anyway.

He is a friend but I am surprised how companies bend over backwards to give him perks. DLP made getting premiere pass access so easy for us as a group I was embarrassed every time we jumped a big queue. I know he's autistic but I can't see standing in a queue for 20 minutes being an issue,

Them are just my thoughts... I hope it helps remove those who play the system and encourages the park to invest in better disabled facilities (and spaces) for those who need them.

Please understand I am not qualified to comment fully on the subject, but I can see both cons and pros for this charge.

 

[Benzin]

A lot of it depends on the level of autism. But you can't provide say, free essential companion tickets for those only diagnosed with Level 3 autism, as that is discrimination against those with a lower levelled diagnosis.

So ends up being everyone. And because autism is being more readily diagnosed throughout (because of advances in detection, etc.) the numbers using these passes and such is going up. Similarly for how you can get a Blue Badge with that diagnosis now.

It's a difficult situation because parks (and other places) aren't particularly built for any disabled people. And the vast array of disabilities in both mental and physical aspects means it's incredibly difficult to implement a "one size" policy without some sections feeling like a cheat almost.

I'd imagine that anyone having "outrage" over this is just annoyed their free park ticket has gone. Rather than those who actually do the caring and will get on with it.

 

[Bowser]

I know it's not perfect but I can see why they charge, as paultons do limit capacity of the park making it a better experience for everyone. While I'd like to think that extra money will go towards better facilities for those who need carers. Like adult changing spaces, better ride access and rides that cater for people who need a career.

I myself find it odd that when I take my friend with Autism to a comic con I can get in free.

Although he's autistic im only needed in limited circumstances and in the more recent past I have paid full price for my ticket and gone under a disabled carers ticket (effectively I have 2 tickets). I cannot justify to-myself taking money from a small con for something that I would do to support my friend naturally anyway.

He is a friend but I am surprised how companies bend over backwards to give him perks. DLP made getting premiere pass access so easy for us as a group I was embarrassed every time we jumped a big queue. I know he's autistic but I can't see standing in a queue for 20 minutes being an issue,

Them are just my thoughts... I hope it helps remove those who play the system and encourages the park to invest in better disabled facilities (and spaces) for those who need them.

Please understand I am not qualified to comment fully on the subject, but I can see both cons and pros for this charge.

A lot of it depends on the level of autism. But you can't provide say, free essential companion tickets for those only diagnosed with Level 3 autism, as that is discrimination against those with a lower levelled diagnosis.

So ends up being everyone. And because autism is being more readily diagnosed throughout (because of advances in detection, etc.) the numbers using these passes and such is going up. Similarly for how you can get a Blue Badge with that diagnosis now.

It's a difficult situation because parks (and other places) aren't particularly built for any disabled people. And the vast array of disabilities in both mental and physical aspects means it's incredibly difficult to implement a "one size" policy without some sections feeling like a cheat almost.

I'd imagine that anyone having "outrage" over this is just annoyed their free park ticket has gone. Rather than those who actually do the caring and will get on with it.

In the UK the Access card specifies whether you require a carer (or 2 carers) to be able to visit participating establishments. So by that logic a "essential companion" is just that, the individual cannot visit without that person/s present and it should only apply to people who have that requirement stated rather than a blanket pass for anyone with a disability or diagnosis. That's why Nimbus are asked to assess individuals in that regard and that's the system Paultons use so i do question the ethics of now adding a charge without explanation, regardless of how high the quality of the park is. As you suggest i think it would be good for them to state if at least some of this additional funding is going towards relevant facilities. Equally the UK and its theme parks offer some of the best accessibility in the world so i'm not going to unleash the angry mob.

In your example you said you're only needed "in limited circumstances" but be that as it may, if your friend cannot otherwise visit i don't think you need to feel guilty about using companion tickets. Equally if you still want to support the organisation by purchasing a ticket regardless that's your prerogative!

Things like Disney Premier Pass are issued based on the qualifications of the individuals ability/tolerance to queuing as opposed to the need for a companion (though this can also be taken into consideration to the number of passes issues). Similarly with a blue badge, you are not issued one on diagnosis alone (though admittedly in both cases it's not too difficult for people to take advantage of these systems presently).

 

[SuperMuscleMan]

In your example you said you're only needed "in limited circumstances" but be that as it may, if your friend cannot otherwise visit i don't think you need to feel guilty about using companion tickets. Equally if you still want to support the organisation by purchasing a ticket regardless that's your prerogative!

Things like Disney Premier Pass are issued based on the qualifications of the individuals ability/tolerance to queuing as opposed to the need for a companion (though this can also be taken into consideration to the number of passes issues). Similarly with a blue badge, you are not issued one on diagnosis alone (though admittedly in both cases it's not too difficult for people to take advantage of these systems presently).

Of course, no box fits everyone, and I totally get what you're saying. I think what I'm saying, with his level of Autism, I think just being a good friend is enough support and doesn't warrant free tickets. I mean we can go into a restaurant, and he's more triggered than at a theme park and I often have to step in, but I don't demand my food is free/discounted from that business. By demanding free this and that, you're holding a business back. (not that you personally are) The UK is good (not great... always room for improvement) at building disabled places and accessibility, and it comes at a huge cost.

I am working on a projection mapping/documentary experience for an attraction and to build in subtitles, and the facility to do so is not cheap. To add the extra projector, create the subtitle files (AI helps, but it's not perfect). And to build the soft wear/hard wear to run it costs £3,000+ and that's for possibly <1% of your audience. Then factor in hearing loops, ramps and staff training. It all adds up. Not that I'm saying it's a bad thing, just I think the ticket price helps parks/attractions develop and adjust for people with needs. As a lad, I worked in Waitrose I had 2 hours + training a year on disabilities. (as did everyone) Think of the cost of this to a business like PP! By sharing 50% of the burden, the park can make the experience better for all.

 

[Bowser]

Of course, no box fits everyone, and I totally get what you're saying. I think what I'm saying, with his level of Autism, I think just being a good friend is enough support and doesn't warrant free tickets. I mean we can go into a restaurant, and he's more triggered than at a theme park and I often have to step in, but I don't demand my food is free/discounted from that business. By demanding free this and that, you're holding a business back. (not that you personally are) The UK is good (not great... always room for improvement) at building disabled places and accessibility, and it comes at a huge cost.

I am working on a projection mapping/documentary experience for an attraction and to build in subtitles, and the facility to do so is not cheap. To add the extra projector, create the subtitle files (AI helps, but it's not perfect). And to build the soft wear/hard wear to run it costs £3,000+ and that's for possibly <1% of your audience. Then factor in hearing loops, ramps and staff training. It all adds up. Not that I'm saying it's a bad thing, just I think the ticket price helps parks/attractions develop and adjust for people with needs. As a lad, I worked in Waitrose I had 2 hours + training a year on disabilities. (as did everyone) Think of the cost of this to a business like PP! By sharing 50% of the burden, the park can make the experience better for all.

I don’t think anyone is “demanding” free access but the park were previously offering it so it’s not unreasonable for people to expect an explanation. This isn’t a struggling business so if it’s purely to increase profits at the cost of reducing accessibility that’s not a great look.

Of course plenty of companions will be visiting regardless but equally many will only be attending to fulfil the carer requirements and I can’t imagine it’s realistic for the park to distinguish between them. For the latter, they are reducing accessibility.

Conceptually I don’t think Paultons charging a reduced rate is particularly problematic, it’s just the unexplained change in policy.

It’s all the more surprising because I believe most parks (certainly Merlin) offer free companion tickets as a blanket policy which I think we agree is somewhat illogical (albeit generous and ethically admirable) whilst Paultons only applied to those with an independently assessed carer requirement.

If your friend can generally cope then it doesn’t seem like that applies and I understand your perspective.

 

[SuperMuscleMan]

I don’t think anyone is “demanding” free access but the park were previously offering it so it’s not unreasonable for people to expect an explanation. This isn’t a struggling business so if it’s purely to increase profits at the cost of reducing accessibility that’s not a great look.

Of course plenty of companions will be visiting regardless but equally many will only be attending to fulfil the carer requirements and I can’t imagine it’s realistic for the park to distinguish between them. For the latter, they are reducing accessibility.

Conceptually I don’t think Paultons charging a reduced rate is particularly problematic, it’s just the unexplained change in policy.

It’s all the more surprising because I believe most parks (certainly Merlin) offer free companion tickets as a blanket policy which I think we agree is somewhat illogical (albeit generous and ethically admirable) whilst Paultons only applied to those with an independently assessed carer requirement.

If your friend can generally cope then it doesn’t seem like that applies and I understand your perspective.

I know you didn't say demanding, I was expecting some backlash from some about my thoughts.

While not a struggling business I can see the charge as fair although maybe the price increase will be justified with an announcement soon on new facilities. (We can hope)

We both have some good points and I hope the extra revenue will see an even better experience for those who need it going forward.

 

[TPick]

I could be wrong, but I vaguely remember that it was only recently that Paultons started doing free carer tickets. Looks like a quick change of policy if I am remembering correctly. Not sure how they could have advertised the change but think some people are going to get a surprise when they next try to book carer tickets.

 

[Enter Valhalla]

This is the thing isn’t it. Nobody is demanding the free carer ticket.
However, when you give anyone something nice, they are going to be annoyed when it gets taken away, even if it was something they didn’t have to be given in the first place.

Say if your workplace upped your holiday days to 30 days a year, kept it like that for a while, then suddenly said “okay we’re putting it down to 25 days”, you’d be annoyed, even though those extra 5 days were a bonus, which they didn’t have to give you.

The same applies with this, so I can totally understand why people are annoyed and I kind of get where they’re coming from.

 

[popey85]

Poulton has made bbc news about the change they are leading with the headline

Peppa Pig World to charge disabled children's carers​

 

[Bowser]

Poulton has made bbc news about the change they are leading with the headline

Peppa Pig World to charge disabled children's carers​

Article in question:

Peppa Pig World in Hampshire to charge disabled children's carers - BBC News

Paultons Park will now charge carers 50% of the usual ticket price to accompany disabled visitors.

www.bbc.com

Explanation is pretty weak:

A spokesperson for Paultons Park said the decision to bring in the change had been made "under deep consideration" and was "not introduced lightly".
"We wish to support as many disabled guests as possible to come and enjoy Paultons Park," the spokesperson said.
"The introduction of a 50% discount off the standard ticket price for Essential Companions enables us to continue to operate this scheme on a broad scope."
The spokesperson added: "It is always our intention to communicate changes affecting our guests in as transparent and timely a manner as we can, and we apologise for not doing so on this occasion."

 

[Enter Valhalla]

They don’t even seem to attempt to justify it here.

It’s a difficult one, because obviously nobody wants Paultons’ RAP system to be like Alton Towers’ was in 2023 and the years leading up to it, which could be utter carnage at busy times, but this change at Paultons does seem to have been ill thought out and was it really needed? I’ve never noticed the types of massive RAP queues that Alton used to get whenever I’ve visited Paultons.

 

[Bowser]

They don’t even seem to attempt to justify it here.

It’s a difficult one, because obviously nobody wants Paultons’ RAP system to be like Alton Towers’ was in 2023 and the years leading up to it, which could be utter carnage at busy times, but this change at Paultons does seem to have been ill thought out and was it really needed? I’ve never noticed the types of massive RAP queues that Alton used to get whenever I’ve visited Paultons.

This isn’t about RAP, that already has a capacity limit.

 

[Enter Valhalla]

This isn’t about RAP, that already has a capacity limit.

What do you mean?

 

[Bowser]

What do you mean?

RAP is the queuing system (it's called Queue Assist at Paultons) and has to be pre-booked as there is a daily limit.

The article above is about changes to the Essential Companion system, namely that carers no longer get a free ticket but a 50% reduction in price.

It won't have any impact on the Queue Assist/RAP scheme because the capacity exists regardless (though i suppose it means the capacity is less likely to be reached if fewer eligible people are visiting the park due to the cost increase). Either way the current Queue Assist capacity (and general operations at the park) have always meant that the awful queues seen at Merlin parks cannot materialise at Paultons.

 

[Enter Valhalla]

RAP is the queuing system (it's called Queue Assist at Paultons) and has to be pre-booked as there is a daily limit.

The article above is about changes to the Essential Companion system, namely that carers no longer get a free ticket but a 50% reduction in price.

It won't have any impact on the Queue Assist/RAP scheme because the capacity exists regardless (though i suppose it means the capacity is less likely to be reached if fewer eligible people are visiting the park due to the cost increase). Either way the current Queue Assist capacity (and general operations at the park) have always meant that the awful queues seen at Merlin parks cannot materialise at Paultons.

Yeah I assumed that this charge was being put in place to manage the number of people using Queue Assist, but since Paultons’ capacity for QA is (I think) already pretty low, I guess there must be other reasons why they’ve done it.

Either way, it’s an odd decision, which they surely knew would result in negative reactions. Unless that’s what they wanted. Who knows. Certainly not me. Paultons seem to have a totally different business model to other parks and there must be some logic to it. I’m struggling to see what it is though, beyond increasing revenue.