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Ride Access Pass and Disabled Access - 2024 Discussion

Smiley said:
Some people see problems. Others see opportunities
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I don’t see what this is an opportunity to achieve beyond monetising RAP users which doesn’t seem in the spirit of what the system is designed for.

In reality we are beating around the bush, the only issue with RAP is capacity because too many people are deemed eligible in a group of parks that have a cheap subscription model whilst they simultaneously don’t have the ride availability to accommodate said numbers.

And thus, we are where we are. Whilst I appreciate this is a Merlin heavy forum, they’re seemingly the only parks that have issues with the system.
 
jibbsie said:
besides how useful is this data?
the pictures aren't automatically assigned to a band, they have to be tapped at a diaplay after the ride, so timmy must have tapped the display to tell them he is in that picture, they can't see where he stands or the route (although they could use the location data from the app for most of these)
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Pictures are automatically assigned, have been for many, many years. Disney won't tell you what they do with your data no more than Google do. But guess what?! Google make money out of you every time you do a search.

Back to RAP and Merlin. Just give everyone an NFC card (or mobile app) and ask them to scan it at entry to every ride....
1. Stops queue jumping in its tracks.
2. Allows instant FP when a ride breaks down if you have been in the queue a certain time
3. Creates super-accurate queue times, allowing a phone app to guide you to other rides
4. Allows CS and Merlin super-accurate data on guests and their experience

Not quite sure why there is objections to trying to make the experience better for ALL guests?? And to enable RAP users to not have to queue for prolonged periods. I want to ride rollercoasters, not buy Oasis tickets 😁
 
Smiley said:
Pictures are automatically assigned, have been for many, many years
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no, not for many, many year, I went in 2019 and they were all manual requiring you to scan a terminal. I am guessing this may have been changed post covid as you used to come off a ride an go to a wall of screens, then you would have to find your photo and scan a nfc reader at the bottom.
Smiley said:
Disney won't tell you what they do with your data no more than Google do
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yes, but what are they changing / influencing with this data, google it is easy and clear, they get a better idea of who you are and thus can serve better ads, of things that you want more meaning you are more likely going to buy them. what are disney doing with this data?
there aren't many things that disney can do with that data appart from advertise products (something I havent seen them doing) or getting feedback, something which they could just use surveys, and it wouldn't cost them $1.5 billion

a lot of the data they gained can just be used with conventional technology. the literal tracking part you keep claming is the key alternativley it can be used with a phone and bluetooth at disney, no need for the custom hardware.

Smiley said:
Back to RAP and Merlin. Just give everyone an NFC card (or mobile app) and ask them to scan it at entry to every ride....
1. Stops queue jumping in its tracks.
2. Allows instant FP when a ride breaks down if you have been in the queue a certain time
3. Creates super-accurate queue times, allowing a phone app to guide you to other rides
4. Allows CS and Merlin super-accurate data on guests and their experience
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you are sudgesting to get every guest to scan their cards at the entry (and presumably exit) of a ride, this would need to be manned by a staff costing quite a bit

this would also get annoying for guests very quickly, imagine the average person not knowing they need th3ir cards, and forgetting at most the rides having to rumage in their bag or pockets to find their tickets and then they can enter the queue, losing time and having people pass them in the queue, it would also become a capacity issue reducing the capacity of the rides as they would have to wait for people to sort their tickets out.

in addition the benifits are quite slim, only really benifiting the fast pass if it breaks,

the "super-accurate" queue will still not be accurate as the rides capacity changes frequently and are dependant on ride hosts and guests as for example if a guest takes 1-2 mins to sit down properly (it happens) then you could hold up the train and reduce the capacity temporarily
so it would still be an estmimate based on the past capacity (imagine if a trian has to be removed reducing the capacity, like wise if a train was added)

the queue jumping probably wouldn't work, often people will let you past as they are waiting for someone or are slowly walking through and can tell you are much quicker, and often if someone stops at a store people may just walk past

what advantage dose CS / merlin have to having data on guests and their experience?
how would they change the park to benifit guests?

also this entire system would cost millions of pounds to develop, install and money to run, or you could spend that money on a new couple of rides
which would you prefer and which do you think could make merlin more money?
having some datat which MAY be useful, or a new ride you can advertise, and attract guests with.
 
Some people just like to over-complicate something when the solutions are far simpler and easier to implement.

Enforce their own rules (I.e. Max 3 carers, write down the ACTUAL queue time) until they add in digital capabilities at Towers & Thorpe. Meanwhile talk to Nimbus to see how they could potentially look into ways to make the requirements "stricter" whilst not imposing on any law infringement.

If they stop allowing it to be "free Fastrack" as it has been known within the Passholder groups fewer will use it. And if you're found abusing it or staff then you get kicked out and if a passholder have it automatically revoked.

Give people an inch and they take a mile. Learnt that when working at Chessie.
 
Bowser said:
Whilst I appreciate this is a Merlin heavy forum, they’re seemingly the only parks that have issues with the system.
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I don't quite think it even extends that far. Merlin operated parks elsewhere in the world don't have the same issue. It would appear to be a Merlin UK problem.

I saw an interesting thread on the Alton Towers sub reddit, where OP was asking if they ought to apply for RAP. OP said they qualified, but didn't have any issues queuing. Pretty much every one of the 31 replies told OP to apply for it anyway, they may as well get everything they're entitled to, and it would allow them to "double dip".

I don't know if it's a cultural thing here, perhaps? For a rather poor analogy I can only describe it as a buffet, and people are piling their plates high (with more food than they immediately require), because they can, because it's free and because they're entitled to it.

To quote Reddit, which isn't usually a great idea:
That said if you qualify for RAP you may as well do it as you're just putting yourself at a disadvantage to others in your position if you don't. Just apply.
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Well that's the thing isn't it. If two people qualify but don't really need it, and person one decides to get the RAP. By not getting a RAP person two is basically volunteering to queue for longer than person one when they both have the same limitations (or lack of). When it's only a couple of people it's not really an issue, but when a third of the queue is people abusing RAP to get in front of you, there comes a point where the average person will just say 'screw it, if you can't beat them, join them', and the problem intensifies. The only way you'll stop it is by only giving RAP out to the very most needy. And that would exclude a LOT of people currently enjoying it.
 
Certainly if you're entitled to something you should look into it. Pride usually prevents people from doing so though (see the pension credit stuff).

However as said its gone too far down one way and now the general response tends to be "apply anyway and get the benefit of RAP and standby", which in turn defeats the object of it in the first place.

Culturally, the UK are just terrible humans all trying to take advantage for the bare minimum.
 
Alphe86 said:
Wouldn’t mind the restrictions tightened up substantially, just alter the main queues to be more accessible (wider, flatter, no stairs, seating, covered)
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Anecdotally the vast majority of RAP users are ambulant in the several dozen visits i've made over the past 3 years so i'd be surprised if doing that had much impact on the current issues. Not that they shouldn't do those things anyway, though obviously building them retrospectively is very challenging.
 
Bowser said:
Anecdotally the vast majority of RAP users are ambulant in the several dozen visits i've made over the past 3 years so i'd be surprised if doing that had much impact on the current issues. Not that they shouldn't do those things anyway, though obviously building them retrospectively is very challenging.
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More relating to most the reasons given on twitter always seem to be “I’m justified because…. I find the queue too claustrophobic” or whatever
 
Absolutely this ^^^ (past few posts). Just rampant abuse of the system, which I find personally disgusting. According to the govt, 24% of the population have a "disability". Add their 3 family and that's a 100% RAP queue. Problem sorted!! 😁
 
jibbsie said:
having some datat which MAY be useful, or a new ride you can advertise, and attract guests with.
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I give up, as you have no clue about data analytics, marketing, customer experience management, merchandising,.... To quote Lord Kelvin: "When you can measure what you are speaking about, and express it in numbers, you know something about it".

And to quote @Smiley "If you can't measure it, you know absolute zero" 😁
 
Smiley said:
Absolutely this ^^^ (past few posts). Just rampant abuse of the system, which I find personally disgusting. According to the govt, 24% of the population have a "disability". Add their 3 family and that's a 100% RAP queue. Problem sorted!! 😁
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This attention-grabbing statistic of “24% of the population has a disability” does not take into account that not all disabilities automatically qualify for RAP. I wouldn’t be surprised if that stat included people with difficulties such as dyslexia and dyscalculia, which do not qualify for RAP (to the best of my knowledge). In fact, I’d wager that most of the disabilities in that 24% would be difficulties such as dyslexia. These are technically considered disabilities, but would not meaningfully impede one’s ability to queue in a typical case, to the best of my knowledge.

Recent working estimates indicate that around 1 in 100 people has autism, for example. That’s far lower, working out at 1% of the population, and I’m led to believe that autism is one of the more common conditions that non-ambulant RAP is received for.

Out of interest; for all this talk of the system being oversubscribed, what actually are the current eligibility criteria for RAP? I seem to remember looking once, and even as a diagnosed autistic person, I’m not 100% certain I’d qualify even if I wanted it (for clarity, I do not need or want RAP). I seem to remember something about receiving DLA or PIP at a certain level being one of the criteria, and I have not received DLA since I passed the age of 16. With this in mind, the eligibility criteria may be tighter than people are making out, and it certainly doesn’t sound like they’re handing RAPs out like sweets in the way that is sometimes implied on here.
 
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rob666 said:
Around half of those with a disability have mobility issues as the major factor...
Mental health issues is around 35%.
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In that case, then; many people with mobility issues may not go to a theme park to begin with (as they may be older, for example… you don’t tend to see too many older people in theme parks, on the whole), and some may have mobility issues, but be fine queueing normally.
 
It wasn't supposed to be taken literally. Just that the more people (and groups) that apply for RAP, the less it actually helps those who need it most.

For many "disabilities" perhaps a theme park is not the best environment for a day out. Last time at AT the RAP queue was huge for Wicker Man. Plenty of disabilities why you can't queue, but in reality you are just in a different (long) queue.
 
Smiley said:
It wasn't supposed to be taken literally. Just that the more people (and groups) that apply for RAP, the less it actually helps those who need it most.

For many "disabilities" perhaps a theme park is not the best environment for a day out. Last time at AT the RAP queue was huge for Wicker Man. Plenty of disabilities why you can't queue, but in reality you are just in a different (long) queue.
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That last sentence is bordering on saying if your disabled don't try using adjustments. Just stay in because it's easier.
 
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