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RIP Ripsaw

Such a shame, great ride. Possibly failed its checks leading to such a quick demise? Maybe not as planned as it seems.

Would love to see something pop up in its place though, its going to be a very hard year to spin otherwise!
 
Are there actually still people who think Ripsaw might be saved by being moved elsewhere in the park? Ripsaw is gone! I just wish they'd said so before the season ended so we could have had a final ride.
Rick said:
That area is prime for redevelopment with Ripsaw gone and Blade on borrowed time. Sit tight.
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I agree with this. Just a shame that the planned development is no longer going ahead! Hopefully 2018 will see a new, but likely less impressive, plan for the whole area.

:)
 
Rob said:
Are there actually still people who think Ripsaw might be saved by being moved elsewhere in the park? Ripsaw is gone! I just wish they'd said so before the season ended so we could have had a final ride.


I agree with this. Just a shame that the planned development is no longer going ahead! Hopefully 2018 will see a new, but likely less impressive, plan for the whole area.

:)
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The thing is Forbidden Valley was one of the few areas of the park that did not need major investment.

Refurbishment and maintenance aside all it really needed was a modern thrill flat to replace Blade and a floor-less topspin to replace Ripsaw - flats needed to absorb crowds and entertain spectators.

The area will be too busy, too incoherent, and and quite frankly lack variety with another major attraction and the loss of all filler rides (assuming Sub-standard doesn't open again).
 
Rob said:
Are there actually still people who think Ripsaw might be saved by being moved elsewhere in the park? Ripsaw is gone! I just wish they'd said so before the season ended so we could have had a final ride.
:)
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Actually yes .... i'm holding out some hope its getting a make over and heading back later on. Its too popular a ride to scrap.
 
CoasterCrazyChris said:
The thing is Forbidden Valley was one of the few areas of the park that did not need major investment.

Refurbishment and maintenance aside all it really needed was a modern thrill flat to replace Blade and a floor-less topspin to replace Ripsaw - flats needed to absorb crowds and entertain spectators.

The area will be too busy, too incoherent, and and quite frankly lack variety with another major attraction and the loss of all filler rides (assuming Sub-standard doesn't open again).
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I would suggest that a lot of future developments at Alton Towers will be governed primarily by where it is practical to expand given the way the park has expanded over the past three and a half decades, not to mention the planning restrictions and issues that exist throughout large areas of the site. There is very little reason to expand into 'new' areas when there is opportunity to expand where power, paths, sewerage etc already exists.

There are unused areas of the park, but those that do have the above are impractical for use for a myriad of other reasons - Coaster Corner being the prime example, of course.

In the case of the famed 'cross valley' coaster, you only really have the options of Forbidden Valley and Dark Forest. If anything, Dark Forest is closer to what you describe than Forbidden Valley.

I hope they don't go for a similar but not quite the same flat ride to replace Ripsaw, that doesn't really feel like progress. As has been pointed out more times than I care to remember, Merlin definitely doesn't seem to be a flat ride purchaser and if you look at the economics of a flat ride, there are a lot of reasons for that.

Finally, in terms of areas being "incoherent" - I really think this is something that is over stated by coaster fans, I really don't think "the GP" or my preferred definition "people" really buy into it all that as much as this community thinks they do. I'm not saying that isn't a shame, but I think it's simply a fact of life and Merlin know it.
 
Rick said:
I would suggest that a lot of future developments at Alton Towers will be governed primarily by where it is practical to expand given the way the park has expanded over the past three and a half decades, not to mention the planning restrictions and issues that exist throughout large areas of the site. There is very little reason to expand into 'new' areas when there is opportunity to expand where power, paths, sewerage etc already exists.
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This is an unfortunate reality - eventually leading to a park filled with coasters Six Flags style and a huge lack of attraction variety and no or botched themed areas. Sadly what has also happened at Alton Towers is that the park is polarizing its areas with extreme thrills (X-Sector, FV, DF) at one end and kiddies (CBeebies, CCL) at the other.They really have neglected the family centre ground and building an integrated park (Thirteen failed in this respect due to marketing and theme). Frankly I would rather a park with fewer rides and an attempt at some immersion through better theming than one crammed with coasters in whatever space they can get planning permission.

Rick said:
There are unused areas of the park, but those that do have the above are impractical for use for a myriad of other reasons - Coaster Corner being the prime example, of course.
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I don't necessarily think this is completely true. I think that they are just hesitant to think outside the box and be a bit more innovative (can't say I blame them too much after the pain of Thirteen's planning and the messy execution of The Smiler). John Wardley's response to a question about whether the park will have to keep removing rides to accommodate new ones was that Alton Towers still has a lot of unused land which could be utilised. I don't think he would just say that if he didn't believe some of those areas were workable.

Rick said:
In the case of the famed 'cross valley' coaster, you only really have the options of Forbidden Valley and Dark Forest.
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You're right between those areas is realistically the only place a woodie could go but it should be a standalone attraction that is independent from those areas. The station should be built behind Dark Forest in a clearing with the ride stretching down into the valley and up behind Air. Cramming half of it into FV would be a logistical nightmare in terms of both space and aesthetic

Rick said:
If anything, Dark Forest is closer to what you describe than Forbidden Valley.
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Not really - with Ripsaw and (eventually) The Blade gone it will be the same if not worse as Air and Nemesis will have no commonality theme wise from this year onwards and there is nothing else holding the area together. A third coaster within the area would only worsen this and also create claustrophobia. As crap as it is, at least Dark Forest has some coherence between Rita and Thirteen (greyness!!).

Rick said:
I hope they don't go for a similar but not quite the same flat ride to replace Ripsaw, that doesn't really feel like progress. As has been pointed out more times than I care to remember, Merlin definitely doesn't seem to be a flat ride purchaser and if you look at the economics of a flat ride, there are a lot of reasons for that.
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The ride was knackered, not unpopular. Ripsaw v 2.0 floorless would be marketable and a pretty moderate investment. It's pretty obvious its not been removed for future development but because they don't want to keep paying to maintain it. The topspin is still one of the best flats around and there isn't much better that could occupy that footprint in my opinion.

Rick said:
Finally, in terms of areas being "incoherent" - I really think this is something that is over stated by coaster fans, I really don't think "the GP" or my preferred definition "people" really buy into it all that as much as this community thinks they do. I'm not saying that isn't a shame, but I think it's simply a fact of life and Merlin know it.
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Only because UK standards of 'theme' parks are so poor that most visitors don't expect anything more than a bunch of rides with some vague attempts at theming. People don't care about '"coherence" in itself, they care about immersion and escapism and that comes through creating a coherent aesthetic. If they don't care then how do you explain the popularity of Disneyland, Universal and Europa Park?
 
If done professionally, people buy into design very well, in fact there's no need to 'buy in' when it's done so coherently that simply entering an area lends itself to a change of atmosphere. It's all part of the fun, and isn't too hard to pull off if the right designers are used.

It's very difficult to maintain a theme over 20 years though. A concept runs out of steam and it requires new designers to come on board and really get to grips with the intended characteristics of an area. It is possible but that kind of thinking is far from established in the UK.
 
British Dark Rides said:
If done professionally, people buy into design very well, in fact there's no need to 'buy in' when it's done so coherently that simply entering an area lends itself to a change of atmosphere. It's all part of the fun, and isn't too hard to pull off if the right designers are used. It's very difficult to maintain a theme over 20 years though, when there are no good ideas coming in the right direction.
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Tussauds had a pretty damn good attempt at it during the 1990's given the the budgets they had to work with.

They understood that with theme parks it's all about the aesthetic - Ripsaw and Blade in this instance complimented Nemesis aesthetically and enabled guests to interpret for themselves the theme that is being presented.

Merlin just create a lazy storyline ala The Smiler as a poor substitute for any creative or artistic merit whilst ruining anything that is left.
 
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Essentially the same creative team that themed Ripsaw and Blade clumsily did The Smiler, etc. There are many other factors that affect why old classic designs may be haphazardly continued or ignored these days. Also it was much easier to redesign Forbidden Valley to use the Nemesis style for the 2 flats, since they were opened only 3 years apart. Even then you could argue the 2 flats botched the original Forbidden Valley design quite a bit, with the stone monolith 'V' pathway pointing to Nemesis mostly removed. Still, there's good change and poor change, when done congruously as Tussauds tried hard with in the 90s guests are left with a much more solid impression.
 
CoasterCrazyChris said:
The thing is Forbidden Valley was one of the few areas of the park that did not need major investment.

Refurbishment and maintenance aside all it really needed was a modern thrill flat to replace Blade and a floor-less topspin to replace Ripsaw - flats needed to absorb crowds and entertain spectators.

The area will be too busy, too incoherent, and and quite frankly lack variety with another major attraction and the loss of all filler rides (assuming Sub-standard doesn't open again).
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I do agree with you. With Nemesis, Air, Sub-Terra, Ripsaw and Blade the area had a very good ride line-up. Obviously this will be somewhat diminished in 2016 with only Nemesis, Blade and new Air remaining.

However FV is the area Towers are most likely to get planning permission for a coaster that utilises some of the valley. A cross valley coaster will never happen in my opnion, I do not see it ever getting planning permission. But a coaster going into the valley on the FV side somewhat was a real possibility for 2017 and could have made for an amazing addition.

There are limitations for Towers when it comes to where new major coasters might go.
GaryH said:
Actually yes .... i'm holding out some hope its getting a make over and heading back later on. Its too popular a ride to scrap.
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I admire your optimism! From what I have heard, expect to see some parts of Ripsaw heading for use on Heide-Park's topspin. Ripsaw is dead. :(

:)
 
I'm not surprised Ripsaw has left, it doesn't look like it was in good condition going by the photos of it in the car park - however it should be replaced either by the same model or a different flat altogether as Forbidden Valley needs support rides as well as the main coasters.
 
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