Scarefest 2013: Discussion

[Andrew]

True. Although they are trying to float right now so that's probably why such cuts are happening.

Still, I think this is being blown way out of proportion. They've cut 5 days on the quietest days of Scarefest. Not the busy days, not everyday - the way this topic has gone I would have sworn that the event had been cut to 5pm closures every night!

The blame lies with Merlin - and the only way to go against that is to write formal complaints to Towers and Merlin. Only then may something be done. I'm just glad personally that the event still exists!

I'm annoyed because the only time I have off is when all of the 7pm closures are! It's pathetic...

If they don't change it then I'm not going. Simple as. And I think that this will apply to many people. So, in reality, making these cuts wont improve anything but they'll just make things worse!

 

[James]

I do agree with everyone else's views. But may be I've just come to accept that this is Alton Towers under Merlin and things are, well, crap. It is how it is. The good days of Alton Towers ended in 2003 for me personally.

I'm obviously on my own with my views so I'll just leave it.

 

[Dave]

I do agree with everyone else's views. But may be I've just come to accept that this is Alton Towers under Merlin and things are, well, crap. It is how it is. The good days of Alton Towers ended in 2003 for me personally.

I'm obviously on my own with my views so I'll just leave it.

Your not on your own with the views.

The park is dead those days as it is a school week, my issue however is NON of the savings will go into improving the event. I just get the feeling The Smiler has cost them so much money Merlin are cutting left-right-and centre.

It's a shame as we know the ents team can do amazing things, the mazes at Towers are always some of the best (including been on par with US and European mazes if not better) but Merlin have fostered a climate of "take no risks".

So non of their parks will, hence why it's likely Thorpe are going for an IP.

 

[EuroSatch]

The 'trying to float' excuse doesn't work for me at all. Shares will mostly be sold, and their position on the stock exchange, on their brand. The worst thing they could be doing right now is damaging their brand for small profit return. And that's all it is. They will be seeing little margin gain from all these cuts.

The theme parks are loss leaders. But Merlin clearly don't value them at all. They should make the decision to sell them and accept that the mid way developments are all they are interested in

 

[TheMan]

Cuts everywhere.

Price increases everywhere.

In what was, if I am not mistaken at least recently, a profitable park.

So more cuts?

No thanks.

 

[Dave]

Towers is still profitable, but Alton Towers isn't a single entity anymore:

Chessie, Thorpe, towers, Garda and Heide are one combined group. So if any park produces a loss the other parks have to make up the losses. You should feel for Chessie, it's normally the most financially sound park yet gets little in return. Rumour from last year suggested Chessie, Towers and Heide propped up Thorpe and Garda but there is no proof of this.

For the love of the UK theme park industry Merlin need to split up the parks to other companies, they have no inclination for innovative operations.

 

[pluk]

Still, I think this is being blown way out of proportion. They've cut 5 days on the quietest days of Scarefest. Not the busy days, not everyday - the way this topic has gone I would have sworn that the event had been cut to 5pm closures every night!

I can understand that from someone who (I presume) lives relatively close and can go frequently, but I think it is quite easy to forget you would be massively in the minority in that enviable position. I don't think it is being blown out of any proportion, it really does hugely affect people with plans made. For me with my one visit it may as well be every night, and with the lack of darkness hours it may as well be 17.00hrs frankly!

I said I'd never go back to Chessingtons Halloween event when they slashed the hours, and I never have been. I know I'm far from the only one.

 

[Dave]

Don't think James would mind me saying he lives lots of miles away from Towers (a whole different country) and visits once or twice a year. Sorry felt I had to defend him on that point.

 

[James]

Yeah, like Dave says - I live no where near the park!

I live in Wales and can only afford one or two (if I'm lucky) visits to Alton Towers each year. So I do know how things like this can affect planned visits (my visits have to be planned 2-4 months in advance). In fact my visit this year in April was messed up because of The Smiler not opening! I'll have to wait until 2014 to ride it now when originally I was under the impression it was going to be open at the start of this year. I sadly don't have the benefit of being able to visit the park whenever I like.

My point is just that they have made cuts on the quiet days, not the following week which is when kids are off school and the majority of the general public will visit the park. But like I said, it would be ideal if no cuts could happen. Clearly Alton Towers are in a tough position.

 

[James]

It's a shame as we know the ents team can do amazing things, the mazes at Towers are always some of the best (including been on par with US and European mazes if not better) but Merlin have fostered a climate of "take no risks".

So non of their parks will, hence why it's likely Thorpe are going for an IP.

Very true. I've heard a lot of positive stuff about the current ents manager too. They can pull off some great stuff, just when they have the budgets that allow them to do so! They manage quite well with what they've got at least. Ents is something I think needs more money pumped into it though.

 

[TheMan]

Clearly Alton Towers are in a tough position.

I just don't believe this.

Not saying I cannot be wrong, but "tough" position, and forced false economic obvious profiteering to fund an inflated value flotation of the group position, are two very, very different things.

No offense James of course, we all have our opinions, mine on this particular issue is they should be going in the opposite direction.

People are becoming more and more dissatisfied with the place in general. I don't doubt this was another choice Alton were forced to make, however whoever is passing this nonsense down has absolutely no sense of the industry and are cheapening, and slowly eroding, exactly what Alton Towers stood for.

 

[James]

When I say tough, I mean in the respect that they have little choice into how budgets work. Merlin is the one providing the money. If they say "we're cutting £200,000 from your park operations" Alton Towers is stuck with having to do some things that could severely affect the park.

 

[QTXAdsy]

This pretty much sums up all the failures of Merlin's handling of everything at AT of late...

Spoiler

 

[EuroSatch]

Towers is still profitable, but Alton Towers isn't a single entity anymore:

Chessie, Thorpe, towers, Garda and Heide are one combined group. So if any park produces a loss the other parks have to make up the losses. You should feel for Chessie, it's normally the most financially sound park yet gets little in return. Rumour from last year suggested Chessie, Towers and Heide propped up Thorpe and Garda but there is no proof of this.

For the love of the UK theme park industry Merlin need to split up the parks to other companies, they have no inclination for innovative operations.

They're only profitable at the top level, what we call 'funny money level' at the bank. Out of the three business sectors of Legoland, Midway and Theme Park Resorts, theme parks bring in very little to Merlin's bottom line

 

[AstroDan]

It should be noted that a lot of UK schools will be off the first week of the event, due to the massive increase in Academies.

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2

 

[Dave]

Towers is still profitable, but Alton Towers isn't a single entity anymore:

Chessie, Thorpe, towers, Garda and Heide are one combined group. So if any park produces a loss the other parks have to make up the losses. You should feel for Chessie, it's normally the most financially sound park yet gets little in return. Rumour from last year suggested Chessie, Towers and Heide propped up Thorpe and Garda but there is no proof of this.

For the love of the UK theme park industry Merlin need to split up the parks to other companies, they have no inclination for innovative operations.

They're only profitable at the top level, what we call 'funny money level' at the bank. Out of the three business sectors of Legoland, Midway and Theme Park Resorts, theme parks bring in very little to Merlin's bottom line

Yeah the TPR group as a whole is dire, was just relating it to the other parks in the group where Towers isn't the worst.

 

[pluk]

Yeah, like Dave says - I live no where near the park!

Ah, fair enough. I find it even harder to understand how you have your 'forgiving' view on this then! It is a big deal and damaging to the park.

 

[Kelpie]

Oh dear.
Oh dear, oh dear...

Back in 2010, Diogo and I went to our first Scaregest together. A last minute decision (we realised we would make the then TTF meet about a week beforehand) involving picking Diogo up straight from work around 7pm on the Friday night (and myself due to start work at 4.30am on the Monday) and our usual three hour drive to Towers - which for various reasons became a ten hour drive and crawling into bed at the Weathervane at 5am Saturday morning...
It was the best Scarefest we've both been to. Fab lighting around the park, great atmosphere, we ended up bailing on the paid mazes from sheer knackeredness but those were by the hotels that year and on going well past 11pm...

Subsequently each Scarefest as an 'event' on park has gotten less and less. My personal thoughts on what I'd change about it aside, The Sanctuary was a great addition... but once you were out of the area of Towers Street and the three mazes, you'd have struggled to know it was Halloween. The lighting was awful, where there was anything on the rides and coasters the huge white generator floods completely washed it out - and as we both work in lighting, this is 1) really important to us and 2) know just how much atmosphere lighing is responsible for creating. Walk into a TV studio with just the houselights on - oh those sets look drab and bad! As much as the view I know here is Phantasialand generally feels like a sterile park compared to Towers, having been there at New Year you knew exactly what time of year it was wherever you were on the park - ITS CHRISTMAS! - and I loved the atmosphere that created. And this is what should be happening around Towers during Scarefest.

Both Diogo and I are not restricted by school holiday times to visit, so as a general preference - we don't visit then! Last year we came up on the Thursday night to have the whole Friday on park before the official TST meet on the Saturday/Sunday, partially because we would have a chance to get a lot of rides in before the meet (which traditionally involves faff). But also as we live a long drive away we don't go to the park very often so we really wanted to make the most of the trip up by having the extra day. Purposefully being there on a quiet park day to get the most out of the park without the crowds! And the extra bonus of three evenings we could enjoy the night time riding.
Apart from the poor atmosphere in the majority of the park, the resort also managed to fail us on the Thursday night as we called up with a Secret Garden booking on the drive up for a quiet meal, only to discover when we turned up for the booking the resturant was closed from a conference funtion taking the resturant staff away... Needless to say our enthusiasm to come to Scarefest again had already waned before this latest announcement...

And with this new news? 7pm closing I mean... WTF?!?!

People will just not bother coming at all on those 5 days. Those like us who are 'child free' and can take holiday outside of weekends and school holidays will wonder firstly what else will be cut from those days in terms of actors/shows/other touches that add to the event atmosphere. I fear it will just be "usual Alton Towers but dark-ish". With the cuts in hours across the season for term time weekdays already, as a demographic we are certainly not valued as guests. Secondly, the point others have made that why decide to come on those days when you could go a few days later and have two extra hours on park, IN THE DARK. Which is surely the main attraction of the event to people? So they're going to be left entirely unsurprised that attendence will be even lower on those days, losing both the planned trip visitors delaying it and the spur of the moment local visitors who can make it there for a few hours in the evening during that week. As has also been said, they should be looking at why that is and trying to change it than just cutting back because they think those days are just 'quiet'. They're making them quiet by their own actions.

Diogo's already stated he wasn't wanting to go this year before this news and doubly so now. I've yet to go to Towers at all this year, and at this rate, wont be either. The Smiler will have to wait (though with it's unreliability perhaps that's not a bad thing). Honestly, at this point, the only draw of Scarefest is meeting up with all of you, and the fun of dressing up for the evening as a big group which is always a blast! Which is nothing to do with actually going to Towers itself. That seems mightily wrong, but the absolute truth.

 

[Andrew]

Moving away from the rather tedious ( ) topic of the opening hours, does anyone know when the maze details and other events are going to be announced?

It's usually around this period isn't it?

 

[Dave]

Moving away from the rather tedious ( ) topic of the opening hours, does anyone know when the maze details and other events are going to be announced?

It's usually around this period isn't it?

Late August, early September probably.