• ℹ️ Heads up...

    This is a popular topic that is fast moving Guest - before posting, please ensure that you check out the first post in the topic for a quick reminder of guidelines, and importantly a summary of the known facts and information so far. Thanks.

TBC: SW9 Speculation

Status
This topic has been locked. No further replies can be posted.
Skyscraper said:
Yes the marketing was good, but don't forget that I rode one of them. ;)
Click to expand...

Hahahaha. If that's meant to make me jealous it's not working. ;)

Anyway back on topic to SW9....

Quite like to see a racing coaster similar to West Coast Racers (with a different theme of course). I feel like that could work well for the park due to heigh restrictions and also introduce another coaster that doesn't need to have a 1.4m height restriction. Air Car park would be perfect place for this. Could even be a part of a new themed area. A steam Punk area would be amazing.
 
With regard to the earlier discussed video, Jared over on CoasterForce (who manages Chessington Buzz and has good connections within Merlin) has offered his opinions as well as some knowledge he has regarding upcoming trends within Merlin. Here’s his post; I know that this isn’t just about Towers, and isn’t about SW9 per se, but I feel like it does contain some potentially interesting info that could give a promising indication of Towers’ future. I’ll highlight some of the Towers-centric bits, but there’s also some interesting bits about Thorpe & Chessington too:
Jared from CoasterForce said:
[The video being discussed] was interesting. I also believe there is a certain level of truth surrounding it, although I think the timings are likely wrong. Here's how I see things based on what I've seen and heard.


2022: Removal of Old Town. Relocation of the Timber Tug Boat and Lumber Jump rides to elsewhere. Rocky Express removed and retired. Land clearing and perhaps the total removal of Loggers and Slammer.

2023: Project Amazon - This is STILL awaiting planning permission, but this isn't hopefully too far off now. They're also hoping to open phase one of the safari lodges this season.

2024: Thorpe Park B&M Hyper Coaster - I believe planning will go in late this year, early next year for a 2024 opening. Just use the Project Amazon time scales and add a bit more time to it to allow for a bigger project.

2024: Alton Towers celebrate 30 years of Nemesis. They reopen Sub-Terra in some form.

2025: Nemesis re-track. It's long been on the cards. It's showing its age, it cannot be cheap to repair, So why not just do a like for like replacement. Merlin has recently shown form with this. With both Heide Park and Gardaland having had two of their most popular rides reworked.


As for what's next. That's anyone's guess.


Project Amazon represents part of a planned £60m worth of investments into Chessington. Now, I don't know if the others have been given a similar level of CAPEX, but even if it's a fraction of that amount, we could still be looking at Thorpe and Towers getting £20/30m each. That's not a small sum of money. Since Kirkbi and Blackstone have taken back over Merlin, investment has been gradually on the rise. In fact, in a recent interview. Nick Varney actually said that they were actively looking to expand the Resort Theme Parks portfolio. If they were doing that, I doubt they'd be worried about their cash flow post-pandemic.


I think Towers before the re-track will look to install a few new flat rides. I think the Retro squad proved a few things to Merlin / Towers this year and would be the perfect way to plug the gap between now and 2024/25. In fact, they're installing 3/4 new rides in CBeebies land for next season. So I can only see more flats coming in over the next few seasons.


And before anyone says it, no. The Sub-Terra towers haven't been bloody removed.
Click to expand...
Here’s a link to CoasterForce, where Jared’s full post is: https://coasterforce.com/forums/threads/thorpe-park-2024.45090/page-15#post-1121630

Interesting stuff… from past experience, Jared is an extremely trustworthy source, so to hear him say stuff like this is very exciting!

On the topic of SW9, though, it also indicates that we’ll be waiting until at least 2025, with the Nemesis re-track taking its place as the next major CAPEX investment.
P.S. Sorry if this is the wrong thread for this. I just thought it might be relevant given that everyone was discussing the video in here.
 
A Nemmy re-track needs to be done so I'm happy if that rumour is true. It's an absolute world class attraction and needs to be saved. I hope I'm still riding it when I'm in my 50's.
 
Seems a bit odd that Alton Towers would celebrate thirty years of Nemesis by er, having it closed for a year? I can see it closing in 2023 and then reopening at the appropriate time. Then perhaps SW9 shortly thereafter in 2025.
 
As for Jarred rumours suggestions over on coaster force: they all seem fairly reasonable to me and would make a lot of sense so I'd say that's the likely outcome of all of this.

As for Alton Towers not needing a new SW right know, well I agree and Personally I don't expect to see one just yet and I'm really not sure on the timings based on Jared's suggestions we could be waiting until 2027 until the next SW. I'm not sure the park would want to wait that long. This thread is made to discuss SW9 and not to discuss what's needed in the middle. We know what the park needs and I suspect we'll get some flat rides and some other family rides in between.
 
Plastic Person said:
Seems a bit odd that Alton Towers would celebrate thirty years of Nemesis by er, having it closed for a year? I can see it closing in 2023 and then reopening at the appropriate time. Then perhaps SW9 shortly thereafter in 2025.
Click to expand...
I guess it’s no different to how Pleasure Beach celebrated Valhalla’s 20th! Although maybe Jared was suggesting that Nemesis would be closed during 2025 instead of that being when the retracked version opens.

I certainly think that if Alton gets anything even remotely close to the £60m that Chessington has been allocated over the next 5 years, then SW9 could well be closer to the Nemesis retrack than we expect… in fact, dare I suggest that SW9 could well open the year that Nemesis is closed?

Apologies for going off-topic (I guess that there’s a number of threads in which this could be more relevant than this one), but I just thought Jared’s post could provide some interesting discussion, as well as a bit of optimism regarding the parks’ future.
 
JAperson said:
There's nothing saying that isn't a possibility and actually it could make quite a lot of sense in my opinion.
Click to expand...
I certainly think it would make sense, personally; unveil a new ride in order to offset another major ride being closed, and then reveal Nemesis V2 as a way to get people to return for a second year!

I know Nemesis isn’t the most popular ride on park these days, but I certainly think that would be one heck of a double whammy!
 
Matt N said:
I know that’s what many enthusiasts think, but does the average guest think this, and is the current strategy failing as a business model? Personally, I’d say that I could provide numerous pieces of data and case studies to add to the notion that the average guest’s level of yearning for this is far lower than that of us enthusiasts, and the lack of a more varied lineup is not having much of an effect on the park’s overall success.

So my point is; even though many of us enthusiasts are keen to see more variety, does the average visitor really care about the lack of non-coaster things to do? And does the lack of a more varied lineup really have an impact on the park’s success (both in terms of attendance and profit)?
Click to expand...

The GP don't necessarily know what they want, not in those terms anyway.

In terms of park lone up overall they know if they've had a good day, if they have been on enough rides, if the queues were too long, etc etc. They don't look at an area and think 'that could do with a polyp, a topple tower and a breakdance', they look at and think 'there's only one ride open and it has a 2 hour queue'.

In terms of hardware they'll know if they do or don't like 'spinny things' or 'droppy things', and not be happy if there isn't a broad enough range to cater to their tastes.

In terms of presentation they won't necessarily consider the individual aspects of upkeep and theming, they won't be riding duel thinking 'the lighting is off, the effects are broken, the sound is inconsistent, the shooting is repetitive', they'll just know if they enjoyed it or not. Most people are fairly blind to grubbiness and worn theming on an individual issue basis, but at the end of the day they will have a feel for how he whole place is, that it just feels unloved.

The public want variety, they want enough attractions to spread the queues. They don't necessarily know it, but they do.
 
Matt N said:
I know Nemesis isn’t the most popular ride on park these days, but I certainly think that would be one heck of a double whammy!
Click to expand...
Nemesis is synonymous with roller coasters in the UK, along with the big one and probably smiler. Telling people its been 'reborn' or whatever would probably interest them. Not meaning to go off topic of course but yes I think a nemesis retrack would attract people and opening an SW around that time too could really create a buzz around Alton Towers the likes of we haven't seen in a long time.
 
For what it’s worth; to lead Jared’s predictions back on topic a bit more, I am a member on CF, and I have asked him what his thoughts are on SW9 more specifically, if he has any. I’ll tell you guys if he says anything of interest.
 
Important to remember that those are his thoughts on what might happen based on what he has heard, not that he has been told all of that stuff is going to happen. Key difference there. Merlin will not be divulging all of their future plans so readily to enthusiasts.

Different people hear different things from different people with Merlin/the parks themselves. For example, Jared states that there are going to be 3 or 4 new rides in CBeebies Land next year; I am not so sure that is true (not saying it's not true though).
 
I could see Alton closing Nemesis at some point next season, having it shut all of 2023, and then reopening it in 2024 celebrating its 30th birthday. That’s a good thing to then market. I’m guessing it would stay he same ride, but probably a refurbished station, probably a better story, maybe a pre show or something to bring it up to date like wicker man. And just a general clean and tidy of the whole area.
Would love to see sub terra return as well.
 
I remember, not that many years ago, seeing a very old bloke, grubby grey hair, grubbier mackintosh coat, spending an hour on a walk on single rider queue, pretty much by my side throughout.
Fine role model.
He must have been around thiry years older than me, so that makes us safe until our eighties.
Managed a double front seat walk on this year, so proud.
 
Status
This topic has been locked. No further replies can be posted.
Top