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ℹ️ Heads up...
This is a popular topic that is fast moving Guest - before posting, please ensure that you check out the first post in the topic for a quick reminder of guidelines, and importantly a summary of the known facts and information so far. Thanks.
I think we can stop going round and round in circles about whether the lack of Skyride is breaking any disability acts. It has been discussed enough over the last couple of pages, and any further comments will be removed.
Let's try and focus on what the actual future of Skyride, and indeed park transportation as a whole, is.
They're working on it and might not know if it'll be ready for the start of the season I have empathy for anyone this massively impacts but all the crying and making out it's discriminatory is laughable.
this is quite improtant to mention, when fixing stuff things go wrong and problems can lead to other problems being realised especially when preforming actions that may not have been done in a while this also could lead to a problem where they may not have a good time estimation on the time to fix it and thus they may not have any idea if it will be fixed in time.
Crikey this website just hit a new low, I'd say if you can't do Alton towers without the sky ride then just wait for it to be fixed no need to discuss lawyers and discrimination.
In all fairness to towers they've been carrying out a lot of work on the sky ride and doesn't look like it's a cheap fix, I'd understand the anger if they went around smashing up all the access ramps and put bumps along all of the flat paths but nobody in towers management has sabotaged the sky ride with ill intent to disabled guests.
They're working on it and might not know if it'll be ready for the start of the season I have empathy for anyone this massively impacts but all the crying and making out it's discriminatory is laughable.
Ah so if you're disabled just sit and wait until Towers decide to actually do an announcement about it after a year of being very quiet.
There's enough problems in going out on a day to day basis. To essentially say "if you need it open don't visit" is complete ignorance.
The problems lie with the viewpoint from the park that it isn't a transportation system when it is quite clearly the main purpose of it as an overall attraction. As such the lack of action/updates on the system are questionable as it is heavily used by all guests (the queues at Forbidden Valley and Cloud Cuckoo are always huge) and causes a problem for those with mobility issues.
There are alternative paths, but pushing a wheelchair around all day is difficult given the terrain of Towers, on top of dealing with people who don't tend to look below the waist. Some of the pathways in Towers are bloody awful, particularly in X-Sector.
No one has accused Towers of doing stuff deliberately. However the response to the closure is incredibly frustrating to those who deal with accessibility issues on a daily basis.
Empathy but also tells those who need it to not bother visiting until it reopens. If it reopens. The park should be doing more and being transparent about the issue.
I really hate the fact that this discussion keeps being drawn back to whether or not the Skyride is a mobility/ disability aid. It 100% is not. We know this because is is classified as a ride and does not appear anywhere on the parks accessibility guide as anything other than this. I get that it is helpful to those with reduced mobility, but it's removal can not be classified as discrimination.
I think we can stop going round and round in circles about whether the lack of Skyride is breaking any disability acts. It has been discussed enough over the last couple of pages, and any further comments will be removed.
Let's try and focus on what the actual future of Skyride, and indeed park transportation as a whole, is.
Having read the last few pages, a number of reports, and the legislation itself, I wonder if I might offer a few thoughts? Warning: long post that covers many subjects...!
Rob, I recognise that the time the Skyride has been unavailable has had a significant impact on you, and it continues to be a point of frustration because you're not able to plan a visit to a place you are passionate about and really enjoy spending time at. Compounding that is a complete lack of communication from the park, who don't seem to acknowledge there is a problem. Whilst it is evidently poor customer service with a lack of transparency and clear communication, the park are under no obligation to explain why the attraction has been unavailable, as per the Terms and Conditions (excerpt in the below spoiler tag).
Our commitment to provide a service:
Merlin will endeavour to ensure that as many rides and attractions as possible are available for use by guests at the Attraction. However, we reserve the right, without prior notice, to close and change the programme of rides and attractions and/or the Attraction's operating hours. Merlin in its absolute discretion reserves the right to close the whole or any part of the Attraction at any time or to restrict the number of persons having access to the Attraction. The reason for any closure or restriction provided by this condition may include technical or operational reasons, capacity, inclement weather, special events or to ensure the safety and security of guests or if Merlin reasonably considers the circumstances so require. For tickets purchased in advance, if the whole Attraction is closed for any of the reasons set out above, Merlin may offer replacement Tickets for admission to the Attraction on an alternative date in substitution for any other form of redress.
As someone without a physical disability I admit I don't understand the impact of having this A-to-B attraction unavailable, but from reviewing the legislation I don't believe there is a legal basis for discrimination on either direct or indirect grounds (clearly I am not making a qualified judgement, and my thoughts are purely from reading the legislation without reference to common law precedent or up-to-date knowledge around application of legal instruments). Chapter 2 of the Act sets out the basis for Direct and Indirect discrimination, and there has been no favourable or unfavourable treatment of someone with a disability versus without a disability.
13 Direct discrimination
(1)A person (A) discriminates against another (B) if, because of a protected characteristic, A treats B less favourably than A treats or would treat others.
19 Indirect discrimination
(1)A person (A) discriminates against another (B) if A applies to B a provision, criterion or practice which is discriminatory in relation to a relevant protected characteristic of B's.
(2)For the purposes of subsection (1), a provision, criterion or practice is discriminatory in relation to a relevant protected characteristic of B's if—
(a)A applies, or would apply, it to persons with whom B does not share the characteristic,
(b)it puts, or would put, persons with whom B shares the characteristic at a particular disadvantage when compared with persons with whom B does not share it,
(c)it puts, or would put, B at that disadvantage, and
(d)A cannot show it to be a proportionate means of achieving a legitimate aim.
At no time has the Skyride been made available solely for people without a disability, with access for people with a disability restricted or vice versa. It has been unavailable for all guests. Skyride was not designed to, and has never been advertised as, act as a mode of transport to facilitate movement around the park for people with disabilities. It is a ride / attraction designed for pleasure use by all guests as a way of seeing the park from a different perspective, that just-so-happens to have three stations in different places where people can alight and join the route.
Chapter 2 also covers Reasonable Adjustments for disabled people, where that is the duty of A (Alton Towers / Merlin) to make reasonable adjustments for B (the guest). Having read this, as well as Part 3 S29 (provision of services), I believe that the provision of wheelchairs at Guest Services and the paths being accessible throughout the park covers that people with a disability are not at substantial disadvantage in comparison to persons who are not disabled. The Skyride cannot be considered an auxiliary aid for the purpose of transport around the park.
Adjustments for disabled persons
20 Duty to make adjustments
(1)Where this Act imposes a duty to make reasonable adjustments on a person, this section, sections 21 and 22 and the applicable Schedule apply; and for those purposes, a person on whom the duty is imposed is referred to as A.
(2)The duty comprises the following three requirements.
(3)The first requirement is a requirement, where a provision, criterion or practice of A's puts a disabled person at a substantial disadvantage in relation to a relevant matter in comparison with persons who are not disabled, to take such steps as it is reasonable to have to take to avoid the disadvantage.
(4)The second requirement is a requirement, where a physical feature puts a disabled person at a substantial disadvantage in relation to a relevant matter in comparison with persons who are not disabled, to take such steps as it is reasonable to have to take to avoid the disadvantage.
(5)The third requirement is a requirement, where a disabled person would, but for the provision of an auxiliary aid, be put at a substantial disadvantage in relation to a relevant matter in comparison with persons who are not disabled, to take such steps as it is reasonable to have to take to provide the auxiliary aid.
The ride has not been withdrawn, it has been unavailable due to technical difficulties. When I visited on 23rd December there was a huge amount of work taking place at the Towers Street station; the entire structure was covered in scaffolding and I could hear some heavy power tool work taking place. I don't doubt that the park want it back up and running, but for reasons we don't know about, it has not been operational.
It may be helpful to approach an organisation like the Equality Advisory Support Service to put forward your concerns and see if they can support you with taking forward your case in a more dedicated space.
Re: Forum frustrations / censorship concerns.
I am sorry that you find the forum to be a difficult place to express your frustrations. I can see that over the last few pages (and in a few other topics) you have raised the same concerns, and I understand that this is because you feel strongly and that TowersStreet is an available space for you to express your thoughts.
From a wider community perspective, I can also see that repeated references to the same thing has resulted in some frustrations. There have been separate reports from different individuals raising concerns that the same points are being raised, which is an indication that the wider community have reached saturation point.
Ultimately community members, and team, here are powerless to take action. Different people have different views on what 'should' or 'could' have been done by the park in response to the event. Therefore, when it's out of the control of anyone here, raising the same points repeatedly is not constructive for discussion and tensions become heightened. The beauty of having a community with different opinions!
That said, I can clearly see that some posts across a number of topics in reply to these points have been thinly veiled criticisms and personal digs that are designed to provoke a response, and this will not be tolerated. As a team we seek to create a fair and balanced environment without censorship, and this can be difficult when there are emotive points of discussion - we will never please everyone and someone will always feel shut down.
In summary, I cannot see that anyone has downplayed or questioned the impact of the Skyride being closed on your experience, and I certainly recognise how difficult this must be for you. As a community and team, we cannot influence what the park does in terms of communication about the issue or their attempts to bring it back to the line-up for 2024. Everyone has different opinions on what could or should have happened, and as a discussion forum we welcome all views. Some members have posted more personal digs designed to provoke a response which will not be tolerated. There are more specialist spaces for discrimination and disability concerns to be raised - this will provide better support than the fan community can provide.
TLDR:
I am not summarising this post. Make a brew, go to the top, and read?
Nice response Sazzle.
Better than anything in any response from the Towers themselves.
It is a shame that the busy activity in December 23 couldn't be matched by such activity in December 22, then maybe this discussion wouldn't be taking place.
According to TPWW latest video, the skyride gonalas have been moved from the location they were been stored. Hopefully moved back to the maintenance shed and ready for the season.
According to TPWW latest video, the skyride gonalas have been moved from the location they were been stored. Hopefully moved back to the maintenance shed and ready for the season.
If they haven’t started cycling the ride they won’t know if it’s going to open in March. The fact they are adding the gondolas to the system (apparently) is a good sign they are ready to start that testing.
If I was handling your complaint I would wait until I was very sure it was opening before giving a commitment.
She did confirm it. I beat her to it by half a day or so, in my original post! . I purposely put it as a subtle confirmation though, because who am I to be confirming things without providing sources.
At least, I hope with the extra time, any other outstanding work can be carried out as they have plenty of time. Work has already taken place, I assume more will come that was not originally planned. So there are positives.
Not sure how ive never noticed this before, but the gondola audio on the Skyride is I think provided by radio. Transmitted from the stations and picked up via a low power radio receiver that is solar powered on the gondolas. This means in theory, you should be able to tune in any radio when near a station and pick it up. Not sure why you would want to and I do not have a clue of the frequency. But I thought that was pretty cool.
I remember the old gondolas where they would play the tune "English Country Garden" and as you went into the stations at either end of the runs, it would fizzle out into a mess of interference and white noise before going silent.
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. I purposely put it as a subtle confirmation though, because who am I to be confirming things without providing sources.
