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The Smiler - General Discussion
- Thread starter Scott
- Start date
BigDave
TS Member
JAMMYD778 said:Ignore me if I'm wrong but it hasn't been tested yet though has it? The breakdowns on the vertical lift as far as I'm aware have just resulted in a controlled chain reverse down the lift where the chain simply goes into reverse and lowers the train. I thought the magnetic fins only came into action when the chain snapped or the train for some reason disengaged the chain. During the vertical lift breakdowns the train is still being held by the chain dog catch thingy that Gerstlauer's have to push the train up.
Regardless of all this, I'm still sure that in the event of a chain snap, these fins will slow the train down sufficiently enough to allow the friction brakes at the bottom of the lift to bring the train to a complete and safe stop.
The magnetic fins slow the train down as it lowers. The chain and motor don't really take that much weight. It's kinda similar to a standard anti-rollback. If the lift stops, you hear the train slam back against the anti-rollbacks. The lift chain takes virtually no weight when stopped.
That's how (as far as I'm aware) The Smiler's magnetic fins work.
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Alastair
TS Team
- Favourite Ride
- Rise of the Resistance
BigDave said:JAMMYD778 said:Ignore me if I'm wrong but it hasn't been tested yet though has it? The breakdowns on the vertical lift as far as I'm aware have just resulted in a controlled chain reverse down the lift where the chain simply goes into reverse and lowers the train. I thought the magnetic fins only came into action when the chain snapped or the train for some reason disengaged the chain. During the vertical lift breakdowns the train is still being held by the chain dog catch thingy that Gerstlauer's have to push the train up.
Regardless of all this, I'm still sure that in the event of a chain snap, these fins will slow the train down sufficiently enough to allow the friction brakes at the bottom of the lift to bring the train to a complete and safe stop.
The magnetic fins slow the train down as it lowers. The chain and motor don't really take that much weight. It's kinda similar to a standard anti-rollback. If the lift stops, you hear the train slam back against the anti-rollbacks. The lift chain takes virtually no weight when stopped.
That's how (as far as I'm aware) The Smiler's magnetic fins work.
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Surely they can't slam back against the fins, because by their nature fins can't completely stop a train. The lift chain must take most of the weight, as the fins can't physically do its job. For example on Rita, when you come into the brake run the train is only slowed to a crawl by the fins - it's eventually stopped on the station platform by kicker wheels.
BigDave
TS Member
On a standard lift hill with standard lift anti-rollbacks that is how it works. When the lift stops the steel anti-rollback dogs act like a ratchet and stop it rolling back.
On The Smiler I'm fairly sure that it doesn't hold still, but instead it reverses back if the lift stops. That said, I have seem the ride car stop at the top of the vertical lift. So I can only assume that it just balances there with the lift taking a small bit of the weight.
If the chain lift took all the weight, it would need some device to lock the chain in place like a pneumatic brake as the sheer weight of the motor and gearbox alone wouldn't be able to hold it in a power failure.
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On The Smiler I'm fairly sure that it doesn't hold still, but instead it reverses back if the lift stops. That said, I have seem the ride car stop at the top of the vertical lift. So I can only assume that it just balances there with the lift taking a small bit of the weight.
If the chain lift took all the weight, it would need some device to lock the chain in place like a pneumatic brake as the sheer weight of the motor and gearbox alone wouldn't be able to hold it in a power failure.
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smudge
TS Member
- Favourite Ride
- Nemesis
I can't imagine the magnetic anti-rollbacks would be engaged until the lift stops though. This would otherwise cause resistance pulling trains up the lift. I think that's where the clunk might come from.
The magnetic fins on the other hand, work like Rita as you say, they create more resistance the faster you are moving, so naturally they would be unable to stop a train, but are able to lower the car slowly and in a controlled manor (the anti rollbacks being already engaged, having already stopped and already supporting the train.)
If you remember, during the construction phase for SW7, when we saw the vertical lifthill just erected hehe the magnetic fins were protruding, but during normal operation they are retracted into the track, thus not being used.
If the lift stops, the fins do not come out to stop the train, the magnetic anti-rollbacks (not fins) stop the train *clunk*. No load will not be on the chain or motor. Only then do the fins protrude to allow the lowering of the train.
I could be completely wrong of course, although my understanding of drives suggests that it bloody hard to hold a motor still under load. Think holding the clutch of a car on an incline. This would not only be unsafe, but also completely useless in event of a power-cut.
The fins are pneumatic too, so should the power-cut, the lift will stop (cue magnetic rollbacks no longer moving, so no longer retracted, latch onto the catch cart or track *clunk*) then the compressor will stop, causing the fins protrude automatically if not already.
EDIT: So yeah, as above
The magnetic fins on the other hand, work like Rita as you say, they create more resistance the faster you are moving, so naturally they would be unable to stop a train, but are able to lower the car slowly and in a controlled manor (the anti rollbacks being already engaged, having already stopped and already supporting the train.)
If you remember, during the construction phase for SW7, when we saw the vertical lifthill just erected hehe the magnetic fins were protruding, but during normal operation they are retracted into the track, thus not being used.
If the lift stops, the fins do not come out to stop the train, the magnetic anti-rollbacks (not fins) stop the train *clunk*. No load will not be on the chain or motor. Only then do the fins protrude to allow the lowering of the train.
I could be completely wrong of course, although my understanding of drives suggests that it bloody hard to hold a motor still under load. Think holding the clutch of a car on an incline. This would not only be unsafe, but also completely useless in event of a power-cut.
The fins are pneumatic too, so should the power-cut, the lift will stop (cue magnetic rollbacks no longer moving, so no longer retracted, latch onto the catch cart or track *clunk*) then the compressor will stop, causing the fins protrude automatically if not already.
EDIT: So yeah, as above
Alexsutton
TS Member
The fins aren't pneumatic on the lift, if you watch a train climb either lift on The Smiler you can see that the fins get pushed down into the track when the train passes over them and they bounce back up when it has cleared. There is a mechanism on the car that means in one direction they are pushed out of the way but in reverse they remain in place and slow the train to a crawl. This means the trains slowly go back down the hill where there will be kicker wheels or a physical brake or similar.
smudge
TS Member
- Favourite Ride
- Nemesis
Alexsutton said:
I'm struggling to find a close up picture, but I'm sure they are mounted by pneumatic pistons. You could be right though, I'm unsure tbh. If they worked in this way though, wouldn't the car start automatically descending when the lift stops, which it clearly doesn't, so there must be an anti-rollback already deployed.
Actually, looking at some Videos, I think you are right.
As far as I'm aware the fins are only really there in the event of the lift chain snapping, like traditional anti-rollbacks.
In the event of some sort of stop when a vehicle is on the lift, the weight of the vehicle will be held by the chain which can then be either restarted or put into reverse.
In the event of some sort of stop when a vehicle is on the lift, the weight of the vehicle will be held by the chain which can then be either restarted or put into reverse.
djtruefitt
TS Team
Andrew said:
Another angle (Thanks to REGC)
I'm more interested in the supports where the toilet block is... They look so much better!
That is kind of what the supports are like where the toilet block is, you can see the long supports going across, that go across the front and back of the toilet block.
djtruefitt
TS Team
To be fair it wouldn't surprise me if this is one of the original models of the ride that was made, of course without any of the buildings around or station building. And now Gerst want to show the ride off so they have brought the model with them.
Imagine if this ride was built somewhere abroad, I bet it would have the bright yellow track. In the UK most recent rides all seem to be fairly boring dull colours.
Imagine if this ride was built somewhere abroad, I bet it would have the bright yellow track. In the UK most recent rides all seem to be fairly boring dull colours.
Tim
TS Member
- Favourite Ride
- Air / Blue Fire
Yellow gets dirty really easily and looks awful when it does. They were wise not to chose yellow as the track colour.
If I remember correctly Gerstlauer normally make models of their rides which they later use at conventions, didn't they have loads at last years IAAPA?
If I remember correctly Gerstlauer normally make models of their rides which they later use at conventions, didn't they have loads at last years IAAPA?
TheMan
TS Member
- Favourite Ride
- NemiLerVion
djtruefitt said:
I'd bet you are right there. If it was a new model, I'd wager they would make it without the terrain included - how many parks will want to create a giant concrete hole to build it in? They'd want reference of how it looked fully overground. The yellow track is a giveaway too, arguably it is easier to observe the definition of the track in a brighter colour. Looks less twisted metal chaos.
I am also glad it is the colour it is, I wondered if it may look good in yellow, but the dark track makes contrast near impossible and adds wonderfully to its tangled effect.
The only thing I still REALLY don't like, remotely, is the mass of untreated concrete everywhere. A dark fascia on the station, anything really to break it up, and much like air tunnel, wouldn't take a huge amount to actually sort out. It isn't even brutally industrial, it is just concrete.
We all know it will just get left though, mind you, they still have to finish building it.
