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The Smiler - General Discussion

No sarcasm was intended, it was a genuine question. :) Everyone is different, of course, I'm not calling you wrong. I just find all steel mice boring. ;)
 
No, I am a very wrong person.

The point I was trying to make is, OTSRs give an illusion of safety and security when their use isn't entirely necessary (just like the 'safety' belts). And I know that some people are very outspoken about the whole restraint thing, and it'll probably seem pathetic that someone who should know better still feels uncomfortable looking at rides like Karacho. If it's hard for an enthusiast to overcome, I don't think you'd ever convince the British public.

When I was much younger, my mum used to tell me that 'Britain has the highest and most successful safety record' when I was fearful about restraints failing. I'm now old enough to know that translates to 'H&S mad'! Even now she still doesn't like me going to parks in France or Spain! (Germany is OK though, despite having apparently the most lax 'visible' safety checks)
 
I can completely understand that OTSRs "feel" safer. I feel the same way about them on drop towers, though now we really are starting to drift off topic...

... Yeah, um, Smiler stuff. ;)

my personal issue with OTSRs on coasters is that on all but the smoothest of B&Ms, they always end up clonking you in the head. Or rather, your head always gets clonked in to the restraint.
 
Laura said:
No, I am a very wrong person.

The point I was trying to make is, OTSRs give an illusion of safety and security when their use isn't entirely necessary (just like the 'safety' belts). And I know that some people are very outspoken about the whole restraint thing, and it'll probably seem pathetic that someone who should know better still feels uncomfortable looking at rides like Karacho. If it's hard for an enthusiast to overcome, I don't think you'd ever convince the British public.
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I don't think you need to label yourself as a "very wrong person" for not feeling T-Bars would be appropriate for The Smiler lol!

Quite a few of us have been discussing the issue with forces involved in such a twisting compact layout. As for other coasters, you like what you like at the end of the day, air for example makes me feel ill! I can't stand the ride, even though many find it force less and dull, I can't stand it - yet I rode The Smiler about 17 consecutive times (as in, straight back on lol) last season in one morning. Go figure.

If we all liked the same coasters (WHICH WE DON'T MERLIN!!!!) then all theme parks in the world would be Nick Varney's wet dream of carbon copy cut outs.

Enthusiast or not, I usually only find this makes peoples opinions stronger, rather than we should or shouldn't feel a certain way about some coasters/restraints etc.

On another point, you're right THEY STINK!!! I have NEVER known a ride like it! It's like the restraints are made from pure, extracted and solidified sweat!
 
See for me personally, it's the fear of what might happen which makes coasters so appealing in many respects. The Smiler with lapbars would add a whole new sense of thrill and fear to it. It's one of my few complaints with a lot of rides which use OTSRs, which is that parks/manufacturers have a habit of over-engineering them, which takes a lot of the thrill out of the experience by making the rider feel too safe.
 
Yep, the final inversion of Blue Fire would be just okay with OTSR, but with the T-Lap Bar(I really hope Mack call them something a lot cooler) it is my favourite inversion in the world, and one of the only rides where I get scared as approaching it.

Ian
 
I don't know officially, but with MACK I just refer to them as Over The Shoulder Lapbars. To me a T-bar is any restraint which uses a central column, with two bits either side to secure the rider by their waist (Hence the name T-bar, from the shape :p ), e.g. Expedition GeForce:

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Anything else such as Th13teen, Euro-Mir, Flying Fish, etc uses a lap bar, unless it comes over the riders head, in which case it's either an OTSR (Nemmy), or an OTSLB (BlueFire).

But anyway, for fear of wandering off topic, I do believe the Smiler would be a much better ride both from an intensity, and a comfort point of view by using some form of lapbar, over the shoulder or otherwise. The added element of fear and danger would have complimented the ride perfectly, with its dark, imposing image.
 
In my opinion Gerstlauer's OTSRs are awful and completely unsuitable for the rides they're used on. I don't know what other people think of them from a comfort perspective, but I find that they only touch a narrow strip of my thighs and attempt to compress them tightly as the ride goes on. They don't come close to my shoulders or chest at all, so they only hold what lap restraints would anyway! The only good thing about the design is the way that it allows quite a bit of ear clearance, but on Saw, Speed and The Smiler at least this isn't very helpful; I still treat these as head-forward rides to safeguard against Gerstlauer's infamous wheelset rattle and rapid direction changes.

Whatever the reason for it, choosing OTSRs for The Smiler seems out of keeping with the ride's extreme nature. It's an intense fourteen inversion thrill coaster with a sinister theme, so why not extend the mind games that bit further with lap restraints? The majority of guests are somewhere between nervous and terrified when queueing for a coaster anyway, but if they've made it to the station I can't imagine many are going to suddenly decide not to ride when they see the hosts check restraints on the train ahead of theirs. In the 90s Towers dared guests to face whatever the latest in thrill hardware could throw at them; a real shame that the park no longer seems willing to push the limits in this way.
 
Cheese said:
In the 90s Towers dared guests to face whatever the latest in thrill hardware could throw at them; a real shame that the park no longer seems willing to push the limits in this way.
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That right there is the more pertinent point to have been made on this issue so far.

In the sense of rides, that is precisely what placed Alton Towers well and truly on the map, and probably why I believe John Wardley will look at The Smiler with disappointment at what might have been.

It's a great coaster, but it isn't a great coaster.
 
Ian said:
See for me personally, it's the fear of what might happen which makes coasters so appealing in many respects. The Smiler with lapbars would add a whole new sense of thrill and fear to it. It's one of my few complaints with a lot of rides which use OTSRs, which is that parks/manufacturers have a habit of over-engineering them, which takes a lot of the thrill out of the experience by making the rider feel too safe.
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This says it all, for me, about the difference between enthusiasts and the general public. When I first joined this forum and started following The Smiler construction topic, although I loved Alton Towers and coasters, I wouldn't say I was an enthusiast. Reading the debate of OTSRs vs lapbars, I couldn't understand how people could want lapbars. At that point, I much preferred OTSRs as I felt safer. However, over the last year, I've changed! Now I'd love to try The Smiler with lapbars, and completely agree with Ian about the fear of what might happen making the experience all the more thrilling. I now love Nemesis and Oblivion with a loose restraint. I do think though, that lapbars might put quite a lot of people off riding The Smiler, if they knew about them before boarding the train. The combination of 14 inversions, how crazy the ride looks when you're approaching it, and lapbars might just be too much for some people.

I'd love to give it a go though...
 
I don't think people would notice or care about lap bars. People can stand next to Nemesis and ask whether it goes upside down (while they're watching the bloody ride in- action).

I think enthusiasts overestimate how aware the average guest is about certain things they experience at a park, and I'd say the owners of the park do too. If something looks good, people are going to queue for it. This is why I don't believe people would just ignore a wooden coaster, if the park was ever operated by a company who were willing to "risk" building one.
 
The way I see it, if lapbars were such an issue in the eyes of the public G-Force would be more or less dead, as that has far more hang time than The Smiler, on account of the lift (Let's ignore the awful throughput :p ). Looking at a lapbar, something which is difficult to do on The Smiler unless you're in the station, is very different to actually being sat and secured by one. They may look pretty free and unnerving, but once you're sat down and locked in certain designs actually feel more secure than some OTSRs. I don't imagine it would have been as bigger issue as some people make out. People may say it's dangerous and they wouldn't ride it when posed the question in a survey or similar, but I'd bet that the majori and of those who make such comments would still try it at least once anyway.

On the subject of Gerst OTSRs, I actually find them to be some of the most comfortable ones out there. They fit me perfectly, and any pressure is pretty evenly distributed across my body, rather than being all pinned in by my shoulders as I find with some others (Including B&M there!).
 
So The Sun were on park yesterday doing some filming and photos for their free ticket offer. They have posted the video online, you can see from the video a bit of the new queue line extension for the Smiler. But also what looks different with the ride cars? (Hint its the front of them!) about 45 seconds in.



At about 45 seconds in.
 
I wasn't really talking about the logos, more about the design of the front. The logos may have just been removed for general maintenance and will return.
 
The only thing I can spot different is the Smiler face logos are missing as well as the leg guards on the sides of the trains. I'm sure they will return in time for either the JL event tomorrow or opening next weekend. :)
 
djtruefitt said:
I wasn't really talking about the logos, more about the design of the front. The logos may have just been removed for general maintenance and will return.
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I don't see any difference to the design of the front other than the missing logo obviously. :/

And can someone print screen a shot of the extension queue line (or what we can see of it), as I'm not very good at spotting things in videos. :)
 
They have removed the yellow side guard things that were added on to the ride cars. And they seem to have been replaced by proper black metal bars. I did hear last year that they were one of the things that caused a lot of the rattling.
 
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