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TST+ and One Day Meets

Joel

TS Technical Admin
Favourite Ride
Closed season on TST
Hi all,

As you may have seen in the TST February Half Term meet topic there's been a lot of feedback, confusion and anger about what TST+ is, why it happened and what is going on with it.

As a quick reminder, one of the values TowersStreet set out in the beginning was to listen to users' feedback and act upon it, rather than just dictate and lead the community how we wish. Often we get things right, but when overwhelming feedback comes in against something we've done (even if we've always done it), we will act upon it to try and remedy the issue and appease people - because that what we wanted to do differently.

We do not wish to say in response to suggestions of change from users "No - we're not changing that because this is how we've always done it and its always worked!" - because that is how other communities operate, and its not listening to users and their feedback in our opinion.

Naturally we know we can't appease and please everyone - but we can only act on the majority feedback of what we hear. And the feedback from the last Q&A was that there was too many 2 day meets, some with very poor attendance, and people struggled both financially, time-wise and even with boredom to keep attending the seemingly standard 2 day meets.

So we announced some time back that we would trial 1 day meets instead, with an 'optional' 2nd day if people wanted to do something together, rather than being official. Why? Again, to try and please all parties, and it gave massive flexibility to people wanting to go off and do different things, or keep it short and simple and cheap by not stopping over and doing a 2nd day.

So it was arranged in our meet calendar that we would have some simple 1 day meets with an optional 2nd day if people chose - and we would not make any recommendations as people were likely to make their own free choices about where and what they wanted to do for the 2nd day.

Roll around to the meet up organisation thread, and we suddenly get a lot more feedback from some people who don't like the idea, despite obviously it had been announced for a while. Naturally, again, we as a team are very dynamic, and will always attempt to adapt how we do things to the feedback we get.

So we decided to make a recommendation for an evening meal and hotel for those wanting to do a second day. Whilst this has unfortunately impacted a persons arrangements, it was again in response to feedback within the thread, and obviously we'd now take the opportunity to remind you again that its always a good idea to check plans where possible as they can and have previously changed in the past too, especially with sudden overwhelming feedback, before making any final arrangements yourself.

Going forward...

Obviously this is a hot topic amongst the team as we continually receive feedback, and we are trying to create a solution (especially as we've not done this before) that works for the majority of people and the feedback we receive.

Future one day meets will now come with evening/accomodation recommendations, but they are only that - a recommendation.

The one day meet idea is still being trialled for the rest of the season to understand if it truly is a good idea or not, but once again you are welcome to feedback on the idea, and we are continually monitoring and making changes in response to majority feedback we receive - so if you wish to add your say, please do as soon as possible rather than wait until the late on where it can cause further issues. Naturally we'll be keen to hear feedback after the meets too in terms of how people felt it went.

All in all, the team do, have and will always try to react on feedback, and everyone has access to Guest Services to create topics and discussion as a window to feedback and engage with the team. We rarely change things for the fun of it, or to annoy people - only when people ask, and we consider all responses and feedback equally to make a decision that is in the best interests of as many of our users. Equally, sometimes decisions create unforeseen problems, and we try to learn and adapt and make the best of a problem.

Thanks all.
 
May I be the first to say... what?

Maybe it's just me, but I don't understand what the problem is, I really don't.

I wouldn't want to organise the kind of stuff the guys here do, what a nightmare. One day meet, optional second day if people fancy hanging around, I couldn't believe the backlash I was witnessing to it.

Friends gather at a theme park, new members are most welcome any time, I found that out - does not require the Magna Carta.

Good luck with the Europe trip team lol! ;D
 
Shock! Horror! People have had the cheek to arrange meets on a Saturday when the majority of people are likely to be off work, as opposed to a Wednesday afternoon. If these meets are that important to people who work on Saturdays then you will sacrifice a day of holiday from somewhere else in the year. If you're not willing to do that then the meet obviously isn't that high of a priority for you. Life is about choices. You can't expect the majority to fit plans around the wants of the minority in cases such as this.

That's the truth of the matter.

P.S - I think this was meant to go in the other thread, but oh well, the point stands.

 
Without commenting on the FHT meet issues, I think the important point about one day meets and TST+ is that doing one day meets for anyone that live 150 miles plus from the meet location is just not feasible for the majority.

TST is (of course) Towers-centric, and as a result it's always been the case that a majority of the members live within a reasonable drive from Towers, but not all of them. There has always been, and probably always will be, a definite bias towards meets/gatherings/closed season plans being around the Midlands, because that's where the bulk of 'high-influence' members live. That's as-is, and I can't see a solution to that, but cutting down meets to one day just exacerbates the situation.

Nevertheless, I fully understand that two days meets are not feasible for some people, either for time or cost reasons (though it should be pointed out that cheap-but-decent accommodation seems to be becoming ever more prolific - I would honestly consider swapping the Vane with Ibis Budget Derby as TST's Towers accommodation of choice).

I appreciate the idea behind TST+, and I can see what the team were aiming at, but I honestly think this problem's been attacked from the wrong angle.

We have always had plenty of two-day meets where some have been around both days, some just the first, and some just the second. That's always worked out without issue in the past. Rather than going down the line of "Oh, some people don't want two day meets, let's organise more one day meets", to my mind the train of thought should have been "Oh, some people don't want two day meets, but why aren't they happy to attend just one day? Let's encourage people to attend as much or as little of a meet as they want, and reassure them that there's no issue with attending only part of a meet".

The 'who's going' tool should have gone some way to alleviate this problem, but for whatever reason it doesn't seem to have helped enough.
 
From a personal standpoint, all I can say is "you can't please everyone".

I won't be able to attend many two day meets due to funds, nor be able to get much further than Thorpe or Towers... but that's my issue. Not the team's!

Each and every one of us has choice. The option to choose what they do. The team looked at what people wanted, and chose to give as much felixibility as possible over meets without people feeling horned into doing two days and forking out wads of cash, while having the chance to see the most people on a single day.

With such a large and diverse group of people, things will never be 100% right for everyone.

We can but try and trial!
 
I wasn't asking for a meet mid week I would like the non Towers meets to possibly fall on a Sunday so I'm not just at Towers every Sunday for the WHOLE season, I will go mental and possibly need more correction.
 
I don't see what the issue is and this is coming from someone who lives far away from Towers and most likely would prefer 2 days meet.

Okay that is my choice if I do attend those or not but I'm not going to moan cause there is no point. The team have tried but if this isn't popular, and from what I've seen it isn't so we may scrap this idea.

Honestly don't see the issue.
 
I think the TST+ brand is putting people off. I understand that the intention was to put the emphasis on one day of the meet over the other but the '+' branding by its very nature makes it seem exclusive and cliquey. I for one would be apprehensive about attending on a TST+ day.

My first meet was Merlinpool 2012 and to be honest, whilst day 1 was great, I didn't enjoy day 2 that much. It was a group mostly made up of core members and most of the day I felt I was trailing along like a spare part. I think I was the only one there without an MAP meaning the day quickly became very expensive and the fact that Sea Life was dispatched in about ten minutes meant I didn't really get my money's worth. My fear would be that TST+ meets would be a lot like this.

I don't see the issue with 2 day meets as long as each day is given equal weight and the point is hammered home that it's okay to just visit for just the one day.

I also think that the evening soche should be organised so it's close to the attraction rather than the recommended accommodation. Otherwise, it makes it very difficult to attend for people arriving by public transport, who might not be staying over or who may be staying elsewhere. It just adds to the notion of having an 'in' group.

The changes to the meet calender this year really haven't worked in my favour. My local meet has been removed and Blackpool has been moved to July whereas before it coincided with the beginning of my university semester. This made it relatively easy to visit and a nice break from being back at uni. I don't expect to have the calender tailored to my needs but the point is I would have much preferred that the calender stayed the same as last year. There was a larger variety of meets and more opportunity to attend.
 
I think people need get over this and wind in their expectations. There is no obligation for the team to organise meetups, and nor is there any obligation for people to attend meets. However, if you want to then it's up to you to make plans to attend. If you're not prepared to take holiday for meetups then that's your choice.
 
As has been stated by Joel, it is incredibly difficult to please everyone, and for me personally (as I take charge of meets generally), it is a learning journey of sorts.

With regards to one or two points raised, I have said some of these before, but I will repeat:

- Single day meet days are chosen for good reason. FHT it is the first day of the season. Mayhem is the first day of CBeebies. Fireworks is the last day of the season. Blackpool has 4 hours extra ride time on the Saturday than the Sunday (10pm close as opposed to 6pm). These, from my personal perspective, are good enough reasons.

- Meetups to Flamingoland and Lightwater Valley have never been annual in the 7 1/2 years I have been a team member on TTF/TST. Generally we tend to visit these parks every 2-3 years.

- We will endeavour to make, as Joel says, a recommendation for TST+ accommodation and an evening meal location in the future. This was, to an extent, an oversight on my own part when making the original post and for that I offer an apology if anybody has been inconvenienced.

Thank you all.

:)
 
I don't really see the problem. Considering this is a FREE site and the team work daily on here out of their own time to ensure the forums/site stay healthy it's quite a joke that people are making such a big deal out of this. The team hardly owe you the way in which they operate the site, forums or meets.

The 'TST+' days in my view seem well spread out. Clearly the team have put thought into how busy particular meets have been over the years and this has reflected the 'TST+' day/meet decisions. Obviously that isn't going to please everyone but I think people who moan about it need to realise just how big of a group this forum/community consists of.
 
It's not moaning, it's feedback. I thought that was the point of this thread.

I'm sure we are all very appreciative of the amount of effort that goes into organising a meet. But if changes are being made which some of us believe may not be for the best, surely it's in everyone's interest that we should be allowed to say so. It's part of the development process. Everyone can say what they think and that can either be acted upon or ignored.

Whilst the meet itself is free (something for which I am very glad), it's still a large financial commitment for many when it comes to travel and accommodation so it's important to get it right. It's also important to have a situation that will encourage new people to come to meets so that the community can continue to grow.

Some of the overly defensive comments seem very TPR.
 
I see what you mean CGM so yes, we do appreciate all feedback from members. But I don't think we will be able to create a meet calendar that will meet the needs of everyone unfortunately. Some people don't see an issue where as others do, it's trying to find this balance between the two sides to this.

Maybe it isn't made clear that TST+ is an optional day to go on the Sunday. I don't think anything has changed other than what we have called it. However, I want to listen to other people's opinion so as to see if I am personally missing something. (This is my own view and not of the team btw!)
 
I think a major frustration from both sides here is that we had a Q&A that very much centered around meets before the calendar was made. I appreciate everyone wasn't involved but a lot of 'core' meet members were and the general consensus was that people wanted to try 1 day meets. We have also had the meet up calendar up on the forum for a while without any major mention of people being against one day meet ups.

We felt we ought to try out what a lot of people wanted. If it doesn't work we can change it back - but we wouldn't be TowersStreet if we didn't try and adapt to our members suggestions, it's a cornerstone of our community pledge.
 
Scott said:
I think a major frustration from both sides here is that we had a Q&A that very much centered around meets before the calendar was made. I appreciate everyone wasn't involved but a lot of 'core' meet members were and the general consensus was that people wanted to try 1 day meets.
I think something to bear in mind is that a large number of 'core' meet members aren't as active on the forums as others - I'm certainly not, and didn't even realise there had been a Q&A.
 
Islander said:
Scott said:
I think a major frustration from both sides here is that we had a Q&A that very much centered around meets before the calendar was made. I appreciate everyone wasn't involved but a lot of 'core' meet members were and the general consensus was that people wanted to try 1 day meets.
I think something to bear in mind is that a large number of 'core' meet members aren't as active on the forums as others - I'm certainly not, and didn't even realise there had been a Q&A.
I completely agree - however the meet up calendar had been posted on site and forum for a while before all this confusion and debate began - which I think is why we (as a team) have maybe been a little taken aback by the response.

That's not to mean we think either way is right or wrong though. It's an experiment based on feedback and trying to do what's best for everyone (in our opinion). If we find out it hasn't worked we will happily hold our hands up and find a different solution :)
 
Just a suggestion, would it be a good idea to also have a who's going list for the TST+ days? Most mini meets that get organised have a who's going list and I think it's always nice to know who is going.

:)
 
Rob said:
Just a suggestion, would it be a good idea to also have a who's going list for the TST+ days? Most mini meets that get organised have a who's going list and I think it's always nice to know who is going.

:)

I very nearly did add the second day on the meets page but thought it might confuse the whole situation. No reason it can't be added though on future ones.
 
Right, I wish to shout/rave/scream my opinions so please take a seat and listen closely.

TST+ seems to operate VERY similar to a second day of meets, but isn't that the entire point? Does it really matter that they are not calling it the second day of the meet? Really?

The suggestions for food and accommodation are a sensible, logical step for keeping the group together. Want to wine and dine with the members and then stay in the same hotel? Fine! Want to eat in the same place but stay elsewhere? Fine! Want to do something different? Fine! Want to hang upside down from a tree? You guessed it, fine!

There really is very little difference to before. You got a huge problem to it? GET A LIFE!
 
This debate still rages pmsl.

To echo the sentiments of my right honourable friend above.

I must say though, I do find "TST+" a bit... er... iffy.

Not the concept but the name, bit... cringe. ;D
 
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