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2024: General Discussion

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have any of you been to towers/thorpe recently shortly after going to, i don't know, say efteling, parc asterix, europa, phantasialand, walibi holland, liseberg?

i know you have. they're leagues apart. hyperia in a swamp. £10 per scare maze. upcharges everywhere. minimal queue munching lines meaning long queues.

again, as we all know, i went on ride to happiness so many times i made myself nearly ill, queued probably a collective time of 10 minutes across about 10 rides. meanwhile i waited in the most unscenic queue line for 3 hours for hyperia last week when kids are supposed to be at school. and the place looks awful and is filled with queue jumpers, fast passers (on credit cards no doubt) and loud, obnoxious tribal tattoo enthusiasts. there were maybe 3 actors in the crows walkthrough. each maze had a queue over an hour. any food item £9 or above. merch at £17 for a MUG. there's only one mug in that conversation.

i went to walibi holland/toverland last year (and admittedly, while both were packed) there were MULTIPLE scare zones, incredibly well lit, filled with actors and people and VIBES whilst getting on untamed/fenix 4 times + everything else on a BUSY DAY. liseberg = mazes all free.

and realistically i can go to plopsaland or liseberg - and maybe even somewhere like walibi holland (on a day trip OR one night stay over) for not a HUGE amount than a day trip to thorpe/alton. and i FEEL happier afterwards, not ripped off.

we just don't compete.
 
OtherBen said:
have any of you been to towers/thorpe recently shortly after going to, i don't know, say efteling, parc asterix, europa, phantasialand, walibi holland, liseberg?

i know you have. they're leagues apart. hyperia in a swamp. £10 per scare maze. upcharges everywhere. minimal queue munching lines meaning long queues.

again, as we all know, i went on ride to happiness so many times i made myself nearly ill, queued probably a collective time of 10 minutes across about 10 rides. meanwhile i waited in the most unscenic queue line for 3 hours for hyperia last week when kids are supposed to be at school. and the place looks awful and is filled with queue jumpers, fast passers (on credit cards no doubt) and loud, obnoxious tribal tattoo enthusiasts. there were maybe 3 actors in the crows walkthrough. each maze had a queue over an hour. any food item £9 or above. merch at £17 for a MUG. there's only one mug in that conversation.

i went to walibi holland/toverland last year (and admittedly, while both were packed) there were MULTIPLE scare zones, incredibly well lit, filled with actors and people and VIBES whilst getting on untamed/fenix 4 times + everything else on a BUSY DAY. liseberg = mazes all free.

and realistically i can go to plopsaland or liseberg - and maybe even somewhere like walibi holland (on a day trip OR one night stay over) for not a HUGE amount than a day trip to thorpe/alton. and i FEEL happier afterwards, not ripped off.

we just don't compete.
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Yep, I went to Efteling and Plopsa for the first time this year and said pretty much the same.

We went from world leaders in the 90s to second division. Seems to be what happens if a monopoly emerges.
 
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Steve74 said:
Its not just Theme Parks, I think it's a British thing...we're world leaders to start with, then the competition overtakes us and we just don't seem interested in getting better to become leaders again.
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Part of me thinks we don't really stick to what makes us a great nation. When we try to compete with the biggest or tallest or most inversions we just end up with half a ride (Hyperia) or a bad ride (The Smiler) The money Towers have spent on mediocre rollercoasters in recent years is eyewatering
 
RIPCorky said:
Part of me thinks we don't really stick to what makes us a great nation. When we try to compete with the biggest or tallest or most inversions we just end up with half a ride (Hyperia) or a bad ride (The Smiler) The money Towers have spent on mediocre rollercoasters in recent years is eyewatering
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I know not everyone is on board with the cult of John Wardley but to me he just got (and still does evidently) what made theme parks special and was so instrumental in that 90s British boom.

It seems like places such as Efteling, Phantasia and Europa (and of course Disney/Universal) still have people like that combined with the budgets to realise their vision and for some reason we now have neither.

I can't think of the last great British theme park ride that ticked both boxes (theming and excellent ride) that he wasn't involved with and even he had his wings clipped. Probably Swarm at Thorpe Park.
 
Bowser said:
I can't think of the last great British theme park ride that ticked both boxes (theming and excellent ride) that he wasn't involved with and even he had his wings clipped. Probably Swarm at Thorpe Park.
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He was involved with The Swarm, although it did go against his usual pattern.

Merlin: John, thanks for agreeing to consult on our new coaster. Just so you know, we've already got the plans for the hole drawn up.

John. Hole?

Merlin: Yes, the hole.

John: What hole?

Merlin: The Wardley hole. You've always asked for a hole!

John: Not this time. This time we're going to do something different.

Merlin: Oh?

John: WE'RE GOING TO FILL IN A HOLE!

Merlin: By goose he's done it again!

Jokes aside, the great lesson of Wardley is showmanship and story. Rides are a mechanism to move people from one point to another, which is fairly dull, unless you entertain them on the way.
 
Genuine question how do towers monitor towers pass numbers on the sold out days? I’ve had a gold pass for 2 years and have only pre booked twice before. Most the time I just turn up when I want to go, scan my pass and there’s no issues. So on a day like today where’s there’s no more room for pass holders how exactly do they stop people just turning up
 
Ethan said:
So on a day like today where’s there’s no more room for pass holders how exactly do they stop people just turning up
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The electronic barriers, where you scan your ticket, won't let you in.

Until this year, when you made an online booking, it generated a brand new ticket for you. If you scanned your pass, instead of the online booking, you were scanning a "new" or different ticket from your booked one. The systems are now linked. Your pass is linked to your booking, your booking is linked to your pass. If, on a sold out day, you rock up with just your pass and you haven't made a booking, the gates will not let you through.
 
Is that actually true? I know the online booking is now the same barcode as the one on your pass, but I've never been convinced the systems are actually linked.
 
Alsty said:
Is that actually true? I know the online booking is now the same barcode as the one on your pass, but I've never been convinced the systems are actually linked.
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Speaking from the two experiences I've had at midways this season, yes. My pass denied me entry at a Sea Life centre when at capacity, when I didn't have a booking (but tried to blag I did). It also granted me entry to the same Sea Life centre, when at capacity, with booking.

I did not have to show a booking confirmation email as evidence.
 
Are the systems the same at all attractions though? In the past, Merlin have not really been very good at joined-up thinking.

I'm not quite local enough to make it worth trying to get into towers without a pre-book as a proof of concept, though I have previously been able to get into other Merlin attractions by using my pass when it shouldn't have let me (fao Merlin revenue protection people - I did have a valid bring a friend ticket, it was purely a test out of curiosity)
 
John said:
Are the systems the same at all attractions though? In the past, Merlin have not really been very good at joined-up thinking.

I'm not quite local enough to make it worth trying to get into towers without a pre-book as a proof of concept, though I have previously been able to get into other Merlin attractions by using my pass when it shouldn't have let me (fao Merlin revenue protection people - I did have a valid bring a friend ticket, it was purely a test out of curiosity)
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This should be very easy for someone willing to test tbh. Next quiet day you visit simply try it, if it doesn't work then you can book your actual ticket on your phone on the spot and feign forgetfulness if questioned.

I've forgotten myself on several occasions and had to book outside (we have one Carer MAP so there's no physical or digital card meaning we always need a booking to get in).

Would recommend our heroic volunteer does not attempt this today.

Edit: I stand corrected, I do have a digital Carer pass!
 
John said:
Are the systems the same at all attractions though? In the past, Merlin have not really been very good at joined-up thinking.

I'm not quite local enough to make it worth trying to get into towers without a pre-book as a proof of concept, though I have previously been able to get into other Merlin attractions by using my pass when it shouldn't have let me (fao Merlin revenue protection people - I did have a valid bring a friend ticket, it was purely a test out of curiosity)
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No insider knowledge with this one, so I can only speculate based on correlating anecdotal evidence (and all the caveats those entail), and a technical understanding of how it *should* work.

Last week I was helping @Matt.GC, by providing screenshots of the booking flow for the Alton Towers app. I happen to have a new phone and a blank virgin Alton Towers app. I booked our Scarefest tickets through the new Merlin Passholder Hub Pre-Book Portal (needs a new name), and then added the booking to the Alton Towers app. Doing so also happened to import every single pre-book I'd ever made, old MAPs, old ATAPs and every Fastrack booking I'd made for Alton Towers.

When I've pre-booked an attraction, through the new Passholder Hub, I get the customary "We're looking forward to seeing you" email a few days before. I also have got the "What did you think?" email a few days after. On the one occasion I forgot to cancel our pre-book, and didn't attend, I didn't get the followup email. This last point would suggest that the system is aware of you visiting or not, at least for marketing information.

From what I can gather, making a pre-book on the new Passholder Hub, sends your booking info to the attraction's ticket / booking system. The key identifier for everything, of course, is your email address. This is why, when setting up the Alton Towers app the other day, everything pulled through for me.

Previously the Passholder Hub was a direct link to the attraction's booking system, which generated a new ticket for you, as mentioned. Your pass basically redeemed a free entry ticket. This gave the passholder, essentially, two tickets to use. The booking ticket, and the pass. Now the system just uses your pass as the ticket number, and spits it back at you in the booking email.

Provided that there is availability, the gates will always open and let you through with your MAP/ATAP (pre-book or not). If there's not availability, and you don't have a pre-book, it won't let you through.
Bowser said:
This should be very easy for someone willing to test tbh. Next quiet day you visit simply try it, if it doesn't work then you can book your actual ticket on your phone on the spot and feign forgetfulness if questioned.

I've forgotten myself on several occasions and had to book outside (we have one Carer MAP so there's no physical or digital card meaning we always need a booking to get in).

Would recommend our heroic volunteer does not attempt this today.

Edit: I stand corrected, I do have a digital Carer pass!
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The only sure fire way of testing this is to visit an attraction on a day which is sold out, and booking slots aren't available on the Portal, and scan your pass. It ought not to let you through; of course this will be a wasted journey. If there are slots available for you to book on the portal it will always let you through, so wouldn't prove anything or answer the original question.
 
What’s the connection to Horizon? Isn’t this more likely to be Ripsaw related?

Edit: This post was originally in the Horizon thread, hence my confusion!
 
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