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Coronavirus

Coronavirus - The Poll

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RoyJess said:
As reported on the news yesterday, social distancing was being observe well at Southend at the start of the day until more and more people turned up. Even if you are sat in a group 2 metres from another group, how do you get to and leave your group (for toileting, going into the sea or getting some refreshments) without breaching the social distancing rules. You will have to walk in-between groups that are 2 metres away.

As for you don't see any huge disaster coming, sorry but you only have to take a look at our current death rates, 2nd to the world and top in Europe, this figure don't take into consideration the fifty thousands excess deaths this year. This crisis has already been disastrous and the scientist and the government has already said that a second wave or lock-down will be detrimental to our economy.

A government minister was commentating on the Southend beach scene this morning and reminded the viewers that we are still in lock-down and that people should not be crowding on the beach like they were, Piers Morgan then pointed out to the minister the irony that it was his government that said that we are now free to travel where ever we want to exercise and sunbathing on the beach was also allowed :rolleyes:
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That video I posted was supposedly taken around 14:00 and from people I know who live and work there was about as busy as it got. Of course in everyday life there will be moments when coming into a space smaller than 2 meters is going to happen, as others have said the 2m guidance is 'where possible', there's a clear acknowledgement and understanding that this is an aspiration and not something which can be absolutely achieved, and you can bet the wording and intended consequences of the advice take that into consideration when it was given. This will be a surprise to no one.

The advice coming away from 'lockdown' can never be as clear as the very simple 'don't go out unless...' instruction. The advice remains clear unless you want to wilfully try to find a way of interpreting it contradictorily or are incredibly dense. The only other option is to go from the most severe lockdown to no regulation at all, which is obviously not possible or sensible. The lockdown itself is already financially disastrous, coming out of it slowly as we are is the only way forward.

50,000 excess deaths is probably the best number to work from, yes we have the most in Europe, but that has to be viewed in context. We also have the second largest population in Europe and the highest population density. Our number is largely in line others based on population (eg Spain with about a third fewer excess deaths and about a third fewer total population) and fairs worse against others (eg France with about 50% of our excess deaths and 95% of our population), but there are so many other factors in play there are no real comparisons that are worth a whole lot. A virus which relies on the coming together of people will obviously travel quicker and easier the closer everyone is to each other, in the UK we have a population density of 727 people per square mile, in France they have 309 per square mile. Of course the virus will spread more readily with so many more people in close proximity. Norway, who haven't had to bother with much of a lockdown, have a population density of just 38 people per square mile. I'd be surprised if that wasn't hugely relevant to the virus behaviour there.

We also have the busiest airport in Europe, used by many as a hub to the rest of Europe vastly increasing the numbers passing through. It all adds up.

A disaster would have been an overwhelming of the NHS, as areas of Italy, Spain and New York saw. At that point people are not getting effective treatment for this virus and other illnesses so the death rate feeds itself. That didn't happen here, if you needed medical assistance you received it. With the numbers involved that should be seen as a triumph.

People want to make out that the floppy haired buffoon is making these decisions himself and based on nothing more than generally being evil/incompetent. The reality is he is implementing the advice of a hugely knowledgeable and capable (and party neutral) team of medical experts, and as was the case at the start, none of us know better.
 
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Interesting 5min clip from an interview with some theme park manufacturers and suppliers regarding this period:



Also an interesting accompanying article:

Thoughts on Weathering the Pandemic as Manufacturers and Suppliers
May 18, 2020
By Scott Fais

No doubt, these are trying times. Yet, Phil Wilson, executive vice president at Extreme Engineering, holds hope.

“Don’t look at this as, ‘Gosh … this is another red tape in my life.’ Look at it as an opportunity,” he says. “I think there’s going to be things from this, that creatively, all of us can come up with—whether it’s a new product, a new service—there’s some innovation coming out of these down moments.”

Wilson is not the only one in the manufacturing community to pace himself and keep a positive outlook.

“While some projects have gone on hold, others have gone on—which is great,” says Chloe Hausfeld, director at JRA, leading marketing and business development. “We continue to answer RFIs (request for information), RFPs (request for proposal) and look forward to helping some of our current clients with their reopening.”
Galaxy Multi Rides, a maker of ninja courses and inflatable parks, continues to fulfill orders—and help other manufacturers and suppliers focus on the future.

“It’s important to me that they [other manufacturers and suppliers] survive, because it’s the strength of our industry. If one goes under, it creates a knockdown effect,” says Mike Whincup, the chief ride designer and marketing director at Galaxy Multi Rides. He believes all manufacturers should share advice with each other when weathering uncertain times.

The trio took part in a live discussion on IAAPA’s Facebook page where they discussed how manufacturers can stay busy, connect with their competition, and prepare for growth.

Pushing Past the Slowdown
While many attractions around the world remain shuttered out of an abundance of caution during the COVID-19 global pandemic, manufacturers and suppliers have also felt the pinch. Yet, several have found a way to keep moving forward.
“The pure production side of things has certainly slowed down. But the service side—working on quotes, creative illustrations, master planning—those things I’ve seen ramped up quite a bit,” Wilson says. “There is work to be done, but the shift is changing.”

Since the global pandemic began, Extreme Engineering pivoted, designing new products. The company is working with other manufacturers to redesign the queues found at the entrances to attractions. The new design would continue to expedite guests through ticketing areas, while allowing groups of visitors to remain six feet apart. The company began making face shields—a new line of business for the company. Wilson says the shields are perfect for owners and operators as they look to protect ride attendants, ticket takers, First Aid employees, and other frontline staff that will be in direct contact with guests.

“As much of it seems concerning and scary, celebrate the ideas that are going to come out of it. I think it’s going to be a good thing for a lot of us,” Wilson says.

Staying flexible is also important for Galaxy Multi Rides. “It’s been an interesting transition while we’ve been locked down here in Florida,” says Whincup, based in Port Charlotte, Florida. “We’ve got different projects in various states of completion. Thankfully, they’re still ticking along.” Many of Galaxy’s employees are used to wearing protective gear while working in the factory. Staying safe by donning a mask is nothing new as projects proceed as planned.

A Shift in Sales
With attractions closed, many in the manufacturing community are not looking to make a sales pitch, rather just stay connected. “We asked the question: ‘How do you communicate with your customers and get in touch with them?’ because nobody is thinking about buying right now—and we certainly weren’t thinking about selling,” says Whincup. The result was turning to social media and hosting a weekly talk show. With 30 years in business and a deep well of contacts, Galaxy Multi Rides regularly brings their clients together to share ideas and information in a virtual space on Facebook. Corporate tax lawyers, insurance agents, and finance companies have provided insight, all for free.

“It’s all about connecting people and sharing the experience so we feel a little bit better,” Whincup says.
Hausfeld agrees, now is not the time to be what she calls “sales-y.” “We’re doing our best to stay relevant and seen by our current clients and potential clients,” she says, adding even JRA’s “frienemies”—friends who are competitors in the same marketplace—are staying open to sharing information. “Everyone is hurting right now and we need to make sure we’re thinking of them,” Hausfeld says.

Ready to Embrace the Future
Wilson believes there is a silver lining in the delay. “The good thing about this is that we’ve been able to spend time with our family,” Wilson says. “We’re always on the road, we’re always traveling, we’re always somewhere. Right now is that magic moment where you get to spend a little extra time—it’s chaotic—but there’s also some great things to come of it.”

Hausfeld misses her office staff—and her son’s daycare. “I can’t wait to not hug, but, want to hug all of our team and see them in the office,” she says, adding she’s enjoyed spending time at home with her husband and young son, but misses going into the office. “We are an extremely social industry and we’ll continue to be social. That’s not going to change,” Whincup concludes.
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Gone back to work and boy have they gone to extreme measures to try and help. Everything is a one way system, we can't enter areas with operatives in without asking them to leave, all staff are given wipes and sanitiser and if you fail to bring it, you're barred from site, toilets are now single occupancy only and traffic light controlled, all 2 person jobs require masks.

The downside we are seeing is there's only about 35 of us on site, with hundreds more still off. Buildings were not designed with this in mind so I can see huge traffic jams of people in close areas. This is the problem is the systems work for now but in many places when there is many folks after restrictions get eased, they're going to be harder and harder to follow.
 
Haven't quite figured out how to quote more than one person yet! :p

@ pluk - My brother has been saying for a while that the figures are not always being presented the way they should be and until you have all the data they are almost meaningless. Some figures we will never know for sure anyway. For example, until you know how many people in the UK have had the virus, how can you truly have an accurate death rate? If we currently have had 250,000 known infections and 36,000 deaths, how much difference would it make to know we actually had double those infections and 36,000 deaths? It would change things dramatically. All the examples you listed regarding the different factors between the UK and Europe.... why are they not presented to us when discussions talk about how the UK is worst this, that and the other?

@ Matt N - I've been reading this forum for a while now before I decided to start posting, and as lurker I really appreciated how positive you are about things. There are things to be hopeful for, but some choose not to see it, so thanks for bringing positive stuff to my attention. :)


I went to collect an order today for Krispy Kreme doughnuts. I'm not a believer that every bad thing that happens now should be compared to "during the war" or that I need to be as good as dealing with bad stuff as the "war generation" so I don't care to admit that honestly I have missed having doughnuts as a treat. They don't send them via online deliveries. Otherwise I'd be like Augustus Gloop right now.

Drove past a few small nurseries and made a specific detour to a large garden centre. The nurseries I think were relying on common sense, the garden centre had a cattle pen set up for people wanting garden products and the other door was for the farm shop. Everyone was keeping their distance and there was a good variety of ages which dispels the myth that Johnson has opened up garden centres to see off older people quicker. Personally, I absolutely am missing looking and buying plants as has my mum who has been unhappy with lockdown since before it was lockdown and to be honest has made the situation for myself and my brother a whole lot worse than it already is.

What I was quite surprised about, when we collected our pre-ordered doughnuts from the contact-free drive through was the queue for Starbucks which I hadn't even known had re-opened. At least 35 cars snaking all the way around the building and two men employed to get traffic moving as the cars were stopping us from leaving.

I'm not going to criticise people for seeking out what has always been termed "comfort food" such as Domino's and McDonald's, yes you can do without it, but it is also a "meal". It might be hypocritical from someone who drove..... a while.... to get doughnuts.... but I can't make doughnuts like KK at home, yet surely there are good cups of Joe to be had at your own house?

Another thing which I thought was a positive, this is the third day in 21 days I have left the house to collect something that has always been when the weather has been hot. I saw lots of people out today, and I would say just like the other two occasions I have been in the car, 99% of people seem to be doing the right thing. Maybe the news should start focusing on these people and not the other lot.
 
Spookle15 said:
Haven't quite figured out how to quote more than one person yet! :p

All the examples you listed regarding the different factors between the UK and Europe.... why are they not presented to us when discussions talk about how the UK is worst this, that and the other?
Click to expand...

(There's a button at the bottom of each post called multiquote, that will stack up the quotes for you)

I guess because, understandably, there is a desire for live data even if that data is limited in its value. If it weren't published there'd be accusations of cover ups etc, so fairly meaningless numbers are pumped out to appease people.

Less understandably is the press's collective inability to do anything other than pump out sensationalist headline grabbing numbers without even trying to apply any context to them. You try and find a Coronavirus article from the last couple of weeks which doesn't bluntly say somewhere in it 'the UK has the highest number of dead', it's a simple blunt sensationalist point which is at the same time factually correct but meaningless if you don't point out we also have the second largest population and the highest population density. There is sensible comment out there still, the Economist and very occasionally the BBC do actually put out some insightful stuff, but it's few and far between. News isn't news, it's entertainment.
 
Sick to death of the BBC news broadcasts.
Single issue...the bloody virus.
It isnt the only thing happening in the world, it isnt the only thing happening in Britain.
There are other issues worth reporting on.
Give us ten minutes real world news as well, you can cover all recent progression on the disease in twenty minutes.
Sick to death of peoples experiences being related by smartphones from their homes...constant repeat of the same stuff... that isnt news!
 
Spookle15 said:
I'm not going to criticise people for seeking out what has always been termed "comfort food" such as Domino's and McDonald's, yes you can do without it, but it is also a "meal". It might be hypocritical from someone who drove..... a while.... to get doughnuts.... but I can't make doughnuts like KK at home, yet surely there are good cups of Joe to be had at your own house?
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Yes, it's extremely hypocritical from someone who drove just for donuts :p. Most people won't easily be able to make Starbucks drinks at home, which don't forget are wide-ranging, and very rarely just a simple cup of coffee.

rob666 said:
Sick to death of the BBC news broadcasts.
Single issue...the bloody virus.
It isnt the only thing happening in the world, it isnt the only thing happening in Britain.
There are other issues worth reporting on.
Give us ten minutes real world news as well, you can cover all recent progression on the disease in twenty minutes.
Sick to death of peoples experiences being related by smartphones from their homes...constant repeat of the same stuff... that isnt news!
Click to expand...
This isn't unique to the BBC, all news outlets are the same.
 
No, sorry.
Channel 5 news at 5pm has much improved coverage.
Second half is usually other matters, though some are virus related.
Fresh tale from my journey to work this morning.
Four fire engines putting out a fire, at a florists that hasnt been doing well at all recently.
Seem to remember a few similar unexplained fires at florists and posh fancy goods stores in the last recession too.
 
Islander said:
Yes, it's extremely hypocritical from someone who drove just for donuts :p. Most people won't easily be able to make Starbucks drinks at home, which don't forget are wide-ranging, and very rarely just a simple cup of coffee.


This isn't unique to the BBC, all news outlets are the same.
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At a national level there's only a handful of companies actually producing news content, a lot is the same team just rebranded (cough cough reach plc)

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk
 
Very positive news; a trial of a new treatment for coronavirus in Britain seems very promising as scientists may have identified what causes severe cases: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-52754280?intlink_from_url=&link_location=live-reporting-story

They think that severe cases may be caused by a low number of a certain type of T cell, so this drug will give people more of this type of T cell in order to combat severe symptoms. That’s the gist I got from the article, anyway; I should probably know more, given that I did GCSE Biology, but that was a year ago now!
 
pluk said:
(There's a button at the bottom of each post called multiquote, that will stack up the quotes for you)

I guess because, understandably, there is a desire for live data even if that data is limited in its value. If it weren't published there'd be accusations of cover ups etc, so fairly meaningless numbers are pumped out to appease people.

Less understandably is the press's collective inability to do anything other than pump out sensationalist headline grabbing numbers without even trying to apply any context to them. You try and find a Coronavirus article from the last couple of weeks which doesn't bluntly say somewhere in it 'the UK has the highest number of dead', it's a simple blunt sensationalist point which is at the same time factually correct but meaningless if you don't point out we also have the second largest population and the highest population density. There is sensible comment out there still, the Economist and very occasionally the BBC do actually put out some insightful stuff, but it's few and far between. News isn't news, it's entertainment.
Click to expand...

Thanks a lot! What a handy thing!

I agree, a lot of it is just to have a big scary headline that grabs people's attention. It's like when weeks ago people were saying that we would end up like Italy (death rates and NHS not being able to cope), they then started to change the story when it was clear the NHS were doing much better, and instead focused on the death rate, which when you look at the differences between the UK ad Italy, like you mentioned it was almost expected that it would happen. The big success should be that our health system has managed everything that has been thrown at them, but no.

rob666 said:
Sick to death of the BBC news broadcasts.
Single issue...the bloody virus.
It isnt the only thing happening in the world, it isnt the only thing happening in Britain.
There are other issues worth reporting on.
Give us ten minutes real world news as well, you can cover all recent progression on the disease in twenty minutes.
Sick to death of peoples experiences being related by smartphones from their homes...constant repeat of the same stuff... that isnt news!
Click to expand...

^ This. Our local North West news is full of it, I can't even have normal news on a regional level. I have to say as well, I'm pretty sick of faces and names of the dead filling the screens. There is no way anyone in my family would be happy knowing their "story" was being put on the news. I think it's pretty shameful both on behalf of the families and also the BBC. It's like if they put enough stories out there, they think they'll suddenly make me care about a stranger. It's not happening. Someone being killed in a terrorist attack is news that could affect us all. Someone dying of COVID-19 (unless someone well known to milliions... like the Queen) is really not news.


Islander said:
Yes, it's extremely hypocritical from someone who drove just for donuts :p. Most people won't easily be able to make Starbucks drinks at home, which don't forget are wide-ranging, and very rarely just a simple cup of coffee.
Click to expand...

In my defence, I didn't queue for half and hour though or block the traffic in order to satisfy my sugary needs (not saying I wouldn't have done if I'd had to).... but I get your point. ;) I don't drink coffee and I was last in a Starbucks for a hot chocolate about 12 years ago, so I don't understand the hype on a normal day. Now if Costs were to bring back their Christmas flavours as a special treat for us all during lockdown then I might be tempted. Can't beat Black Forest Gateau hot chocolate.
 
T cell involvement in level of impact is an interesting field for covid treatment.

Sent from my SM-J600FN using Tapatalk
 
Shearings and National Holidays has gone.
Big supplier of grey hair to the coast of our fine nation.
Specialists in old biddy holidays, they have very few advance bookings due to you know what.
Major supplier of punters to Blackpool and the other big coastal resorts.
Campsite bookings have gone through the (canvas) roof though.
 
rob666 said:
Shearings and National Holidays has gone.
Big supplier of grey hair to the coast of our fine nation.
Specialists in old biddy holidays, they have very few advance bookings due to you know what.
Major supplier of punters to Blackpool and the other big coastal resorts.
Campsite bookings have gone through the (canvas) roof though.
Click to expand...

its a weird one in a way it was sort of shock to hear the news but it was expected in a way. I’ll give shearings credit took my step mother away last year with them and for what you got for the money was pretty decent. But I guess we will have to get used to seeing scenes like this. It’s like a guessing game of who will go next.
 
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