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Disneyland Resort, California: General Discussion
- Thread starter Sam
- Start date
smudge
TS Member
- Favourite Ride
- Nemesis
Orlando will be left as it is because of the Universal ties... Paris though, say hello to a GotG themed ToT. Stupid idea IMHO, its theme is flawless and timeless. Its still one of the staple attractions for ALL Disney parks... Films come and go, The Twilight Zone, granted was a TV show, but is unknown to today's generation; this shows just how little bearing it has on the attractions popularity.
Tim
TS Member
- Favourite Ride
- Air / Blue Fire
I had never heard of the Twilight Zone series until discovering the ride, now I'm fascinated by it.
But the re-theme is not my real issue. Before they built ToT at California and Paris they weren't intended to be themed to the Twilight Zone. If I remember correctly California was going to get Geyser Mountain, built at the edge of Frontierland it would have been half sunk into the ground to resemble a collapsing mine shaft. For Paris it was going to be alongside Space Mountain, themed to JV's Journey to the centre of the earth. But in both cases they didn't materialise until the parks second gate needed additional attractions and the Twilight Zone theme just happened to fit.
Neither do I have a problem with Gaurdians as a theme, as a new built ride it could work really well. But as a quick re-theme of a very well executed existing ride I can see this ending up a half backed version of both themes.
But the re-theme is not my real issue. Before they built ToT at California and Paris they weren't intended to be themed to the Twilight Zone. If I remember correctly California was going to get Geyser Mountain, built at the edge of Frontierland it would have been half sunk into the ground to resemble a collapsing mine shaft. For Paris it was going to be alongside Space Mountain, themed to JV's Journey to the centre of the earth. But in both cases they didn't materialise until the parks second gate needed additional attractions and the Twilight Zone theme just happened to fit.
Neither do I have a problem with Gaurdians as a theme, as a new built ride it could work really well. But as a quick re-theme of a very well executed existing ride I can see this ending up a half backed version of both themes.
Tim
TS Member
- Favourite Ride
- Air / Blue Fire
If you get the chance do it. You know that I hate drop towers too and was absolutely bricking it the first time, but there's something about ToT that's just so much fun!
Sku
TS Member
Initially I was upset by this, but it seems clear now that the Orlando tower won't be touched.
And when it comes to Towers of Terror, Orlando is the definate version, and the other 2 always seemed inferior to me.
Much like in Hong Kong, where a twist on the same attraction works effectively, why not change it up. I'm not convinced the IP is the correct fit, but it remains to be seen how they would implement it.
And when it comes to Towers of Terror, Orlando is the definate version, and the other 2 always seemed inferior to me.
Much like in Hong Kong, where a twist on the same attraction works effectively, why not change it up. I'm not convinced the IP is the correct fit, but it remains to be seen how they would implement it.
Graeme
TS Member
I would imagine a lot of people don't even know the TOT/twilight zone tie in is actually a thing...
The theme works incredibly well though as you don't need to know what the tie in is all about, it's coherent in itself. never seen guardians of the galaxy so a retheme wouldn't make sense to me in terms of a ride experience...
Surely though....if it's not broken, don't fix it?
The theme works incredibly well though as you don't need to know what the tie in is all about, it's coherent in itself. never seen guardians of the galaxy so a retheme wouldn't make sense to me in terms of a ride experience...
Surely though....if it's not broken, don't fix it?
Imagination
TS Member
This really isn't a good news. It's saddening me that the Disney parks are suffering cut backs, primarily because of Shanghai Disneyland. However, since the extortionate over spending on the mymagic+ with the magicbands initiative, the parks have been playing a game of sacrifice and catch-up ever since and it's embarrassing.
Disneyland California is a mess at the moment with only half of the 60th plans making it to fruition, multiple attractions closed or experiences currently dark with construction taking place which is behind schedule. This is magnified by the obvious cuts in the overall guest experience (see, I don't just moan about Merlin-only attractions
) which is making guests realise they aren't getting a good deal with Disneyland.
Then to hear this, a refurb of ToT to Guardians. Really? For real? It's one of the worst ideas brought forward by Imagineering in a while and if Team Anaheim green light it (I feel they'll be forced to) then this is an extremely poor period for the park because it means they've pulled out of a high investment Long Term Development Plan for Marvel in Disneyland with new E-Ticket rides. Fools - they have free reign of anything Marvel done on the West Coast. Tower of Terror is a very strong brand too. If you built a new tower (a la DisneySea despite the reasoning behind a different theme) and you want a different version then that's great but to overlay one of their strongest themes? Idiots.
The Disney company has suffered a slow down in income from other divisions but mostly the television and interactive divisions...however the Park and Resorts division has performed so well - so why are we getting a decrease in experience? We need to bolster out the other divisions clearly and the new seasonal pricing at the parks has clearly been brought in to make more buck for the entire company.
Orlando won't get a true Marvel area or overlay...Universal Orlando has that (as I've mentioned in a post before), plus, with the fact that in their agreement they must keep their Marvel experiences fresh etc and they've just completely redone Hulk, we know they aren't letting go of their rights any time soon. Although, it is rumoured Team Orlando/Disney and Universal are in talks of a reasonable agreement. So we don't have to worry about Disney World at the current time but for now? Pray for Disneyland.
Disneyland California is a mess at the moment with only half of the 60th plans making it to fruition, multiple attractions closed or experiences currently dark with construction taking place which is behind schedule. This is magnified by the obvious cuts in the overall guest experience (see, I don't just moan about Merlin-only attractions
) which is making guests realise they aren't getting a good deal with Disneyland.Then to hear this, a refurb of ToT to Guardians. Really? For real? It's one of the worst ideas brought forward by Imagineering in a while and if Team Anaheim green light it (I feel they'll be forced to) then this is an extremely poor period for the park because it means they've pulled out of a high investment Long Term Development Plan for Marvel in Disneyland with new E-Ticket rides. Fools - they have free reign of anything Marvel done on the West Coast. Tower of Terror is a very strong brand too. If you built a new tower (a la DisneySea despite the reasoning behind a different theme) and you want a different version then that's great but to overlay one of their strongest themes? Idiots.
The Disney company has suffered a slow down in income from other divisions but mostly the television and interactive divisions...however the Park and Resorts division has performed so well - so why are we getting a decrease in experience? We need to bolster out the other divisions clearly and the new seasonal pricing at the parks has clearly been brought in to make more buck for the entire company.
Orlando won't get a true Marvel area or overlay...Universal Orlando has that (as I've mentioned in a post before), plus, with the fact that in their agreement they must keep their Marvel experiences fresh etc and they've just completely redone Hulk, we know they aren't letting go of their rights any time soon. Although, it is rumoured Team Orlando/Disney and Universal are in talks of a reasonable agreement. So we don't have to worry about Disney World at the current time but for now? Pray for Disneyland.
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Craig
TS Administrator
So after all the rumours, a Guardians retheme of Tower of Terror has now been confirmed. The old ToT will close 'in early 2017' with the new ride opening later in the Summer. The article also hints toward a larger expansion of Marvel IPs throughout DCA too, so don't expect things to finish here. Marvel have a packed release schedule over the coming years, including two new Avengers films in 2018 so more than enough to tie into new lands/areas. Realistically, I'd now expect everything A Bug's Life related to be on borrowed time, with A Bug's Land and It's Tough to be a Bug being removed within the next couple of years to make way for something else.
Now I'm a huge fan of Guardians of the Galaxy, but to retheme something as iconic as ToT seems completely ridiculous. DCA in its current form isn't even all that old, and sure Cars Land has taken some of ToT's thunder in recent years, but it's still one of Disney's most iconic attractions across its portfolio. The investment in DCA created even more of an old Hollywood feel in that area, with Carthay Circle near the entrance, then following those tram tracks eventually getting to the Hollywood Tower Hotel. The ride is never quiet, the demand is there for it, and it's still one of the most thrilling rides there is.
One thing that worries me more than anything, is that even by non Disney standards, the length of closure for this change is extremely short. The ride is closing in early 2017, then opening again in Summer that year? That's 6-8 months tops for everything to be completed, and going by that concept art, there's a lot of exterior theming to be done. Let's not forget, the Frozen attraction at Epcot took just shy of 20 months to complete. And sure, a chunk of ToT is screen based, but there still seems to be a hell of a lot to do in such a short time that it just screams to me that it's going to be a little half arsed.
And finally, let's not forget that the last thing Disneyland seems to need right now is more closures and upheaval caused by construction work. The loss of Rivers of America attractions, including Fantasmic and the railroad at the moment due to Star Wars Land is already a shame, and removing an E ticket from operation for over half the year only adds to the problems.
Now I'm a huge fan of Guardians of the Galaxy, but to retheme something as iconic as ToT seems completely ridiculous. DCA in its current form isn't even all that old, and sure Cars Land has taken some of ToT's thunder in recent years, but it's still one of Disney's most iconic attractions across its portfolio. The investment in DCA created even more of an old Hollywood feel in that area, with Carthay Circle near the entrance, then following those tram tracks eventually getting to the Hollywood Tower Hotel. The ride is never quiet, the demand is there for it, and it's still one of the most thrilling rides there is.
One thing that worries me more than anything, is that even by non Disney standards, the length of closure for this change is extremely short. The ride is closing in early 2017, then opening again in Summer that year? That's 6-8 months tops for everything to be completed, and going by that concept art, there's a lot of exterior theming to be done. Let's not forget, the Frozen attraction at Epcot took just shy of 20 months to complete. And sure, a chunk of ToT is screen based, but there still seems to be a hell of a lot to do in such a short time that it just screams to me that it's going to be a little half arsed.
And finally, let's not forget that the last thing Disneyland seems to need right now is more closures and upheaval caused by construction work. The loss of Rivers of America attractions, including Fantasmic and the railroad at the moment due to Star Wars Land is already a shame, and removing an E ticket from operation for over half the year only adds to the problems.
CGM
TS Member
I'm baffled by this decision. Why risk a refit of one of the world's most popular and enduring attractions with a flavour of the month IP? Yes, the Marvel universe is incredibly popular right now and I'm sure there's profit in it for the short term but wouldn't it be less risky to either choose a less iconic ride to refit or to build a completely new ride on a similar budget? Disney have always been very good at future-proofing their e-ticket attractions. This decision seems to go against all of that.
The Twilight Zone IP works well because it was never going to age badly. Using a black and white 1960s anthology series to introduce the story somehow gives the ride a sense of period authenticity that it just wouldn't have if they'd gone with a more modern take.
Also, with The Twilight Zone being an anthology series, the story line itself is completely original. It doesn't rely on recognisable characters or have some contrived tie in to wider events in a popular film. You can go into the ride knowing nothing about The Twilight Zone and enjoy it on the same level as someone who is familiar with the show.
By the look of the concept art and from what I've read about the story, this refit will have none of those advantages. It will heavily feature characters from the movie and have a story line that's deeply ingrained into the film's mythology.
Guardians of the Galaxy was a fun enough film but it didn't have future classic written all over it. At some point this super hero bubble we're in has to burst and that may be sooner rather than later. In ten, fifteen years time is anyone still going to care about Guardians of the Galaxy? And if not, do you want an outdated IP attached to one of your biggest rides?
The Twilight Zone IP works well because it was never going to age badly. Using a black and white 1960s anthology series to introduce the story somehow gives the ride a sense of period authenticity that it just wouldn't have if they'd gone with a more modern take.
Also, with The Twilight Zone being an anthology series, the story line itself is completely original. It doesn't rely on recognisable characters or have some contrived tie in to wider events in a popular film. You can go into the ride knowing nothing about The Twilight Zone and enjoy it on the same level as someone who is familiar with the show.
By the look of the concept art and from what I've read about the story, this refit will have none of those advantages. It will heavily feature characters from the movie and have a story line that's deeply ingrained into the film's mythology.
Guardians of the Galaxy was a fun enough film but it didn't have future classic written all over it. At some point this super hero bubble we're in has to burst and that may be sooner rather than later. In ten, fifteen years time is anyone still going to care about Guardians of the Galaxy? And if not, do you want an outdated IP attached to one of your biggest rides?
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Danny
TS Contributor
- Favourite Ride
- Steel Vengeance
While it never going to be popular with some fans, but the California has never been as popular as Disney had hoped , they built it to boost attendance at the park when it opened and had little impact on attendance to the park. Having been myself twice it consistently has one of the shortest lines out of all the E-tickets across the resort and from what I have read is rated lower than most of the other E-tickets on survey. This has therefore made the decision for a retheme easier for Disney especially in California where the market is very different to Florida with most visitors living in California. So is a need for new attractions/refreshes more regularly than Orlando. Having been on both versions I am not too fussed this version Is changing.
Luckily there are no plans for this to happen in Florida, however rumours currently point to The god awful Ellen's energy adventure at Epcot being demolished and a new guardens Of the Galaxy ride built in its place
They could start work before it shuts as it has three lift/drop shafts when they often just run on two when they completing rehab work. So they could start to do work on one lift shaft before the ride closes.
Luckily there are no plans for this to happen in Florida, however rumours currently point to The god awful Ellen's energy adventure at Epcot being demolished and a new guardens Of the Galaxy ride built in its place
They could start work before it shuts as it has three lift/drop shafts when they often just run on two when they completing rehab work. So they could start to do work on one lift shaft before the ride closes.
Rob
TS Team
- Favourite Ride
- Steel Vengeance
This has to be one of the worst decisions in theme park history and one met with totaly dismay. What are Disney thinking?
Actually, I'll tell you what Disney are thinking. They see this is a relatively cheap and quick was to get a popular Marvel IP into one of their theme parks to get more $$$. They have shown no care whatsoever for the fact that Tower of Terror is one of, if not the best, theme park attractions ever created. It is perfection. I'm sure the new ride will be good but to be honest I don't have a care in the world for Guardians of the Galaxy and the new story will probably be lost on me. Of course I'm not the mass market that Disney are aiming at with this though.
I saw some comments on a D23 Facebook post of Disney fans saying that they are just that, Disney fans. Not Marvel fans, not LucasFilm fans, but Disney fans. Disney have now become so obsessed with these other IPs that they almost seem to have forgotten their roots. As has been pointed out by CGM, will this be a timeless attraction like ToT is (and the likes of SM, BTM, HM etc. for that matter)? No it will not. This is a far wider issue that I have with Disney at the moment though. Timeless classics last forever, IPs do not. Just look at how many older IPs have and are being replaced at Universal.
Craig also makes a good point on the time they have allocated for this re-furb. I assumed that ToT would close in the next month or so if the new ride was meant to open in summer 2017. Disney notoriously takes ages on their projects (although I do know there is a new focus in Imagineering to prevent over spending and over running on projects) and six months seems like no time for Disney to turn this around to the standard you would expect.
Actually, I'll tell you what Disney are thinking. They see this is a relatively cheap and quick was to get a popular Marvel IP into one of their theme parks to get more $$$. They have shown no care whatsoever for the fact that Tower of Terror is one of, if not the best, theme park attractions ever created. It is perfection. I'm sure the new ride will be good but to be honest I don't have a care in the world for Guardians of the Galaxy and the new story will probably be lost on me. Of course I'm not the mass market that Disney are aiming at with this though.
I saw some comments on a D23 Facebook post of Disney fans saying that they are just that, Disney fans. Not Marvel fans, not LucasFilm fans, but Disney fans. Disney have now become so obsessed with these other IPs that they almost seem to have forgotten their roots. As has been pointed out by CGM, will this be a timeless attraction like ToT is (and the likes of SM, BTM, HM etc. for that matter)? No it will not. This is a far wider issue that I have with Disney at the moment though. Timeless classics last forever, IPs do not. Just look at how many older IPs have and are being replaced at Universal.
Craig also makes a good point on the time they have allocated for this re-furb. I assumed that ToT would close in the next month or so if the new ride was meant to open in summer 2017. Disney notoriously takes ages on their projects (although I do know there is a new focus in Imagineering to prevent over spending and over running on projects) and six months seems like no time for Disney to turn this around to the standard you would expect.
jon81uk
TS Member
I am actually seeing this as not a bad thing. The ToT at California Adventure was never as good as the Florida version (same goes for Paris). This way both coasts have more unique rides. As long as they actually follow through and expand the park with a Marvel area behind the Tower.
