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Efteling: General Discussion

TakeYourMedicine said:
The worst example of this kind of thing was when Disney removed scenes of women being chased by pirates in Pirates of the Caribbean that had been there for decades, and was clearly done in a humorous way (the punchline being the last one had a woman chasing the pirate). It was just a knee jerk reaction to remove it, by that logic you may as well ban all use of pirates for entertainment, because historically they were all violent criminals.
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The treatment of contemporary people of colour and seventeenth-century pirates is definitely comparable and this is a solid analogy.
 
Sam said:
The treatment of contemporary people of colour and seventeenth-century pirates is definitely comparable and this is a solid analogy.
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Have you read any of my posts properly?
You'd see I was using this an example of how not to knee jerk react to claims an old ride was 'being ___-ist' (when the ride's intention was clearly not that). As opposed to the more justified action Efteling are taking where they're not removing any humour of the ride, just more tastefully redressing it and removing naive 40 year old stereotypes.

The analogy was about whether or not to 'correct' old dark rides because of changing tastes.

There is no discrimination or "hate" in this ride, just silly depictions out of naivety. None of it is realistic about any of the cultures it represents, but the ones being changed are particularly silly and distasteful. They are wise to alter it. :)
 
I think the use of buzzwords can be very annoying from people who seem to take offence at as many things as possible for a sport end and the Baby Boomer end, but I think Efteling have to be very careful with what they do. Using blatant negative stereotypes is much more obvious and a no no, but depicting tribesmen in Africa when that is the actual reality of what native inhabitants are like. hmm... not so good. Theme parks, just like films, games, and other forms of entertainment, will be trashed if they start to fall victim to pandering to people who take offence at things which are 'fundamentally' subjective and above all else, not intentionally racist or harming anyone directly. Why? It limits creativity. It puts restraints on what you can and can't do. And that's a fundamental component to making something good I'm afraid. I would welcome new rides that venture in to unknown or 'uncomfortable' territories for that precise reason.
 
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There are plenty of more creative ways to have an African scene. I have a mixed race extended family that live in South Africa and I used to visit a lot, there's loads of traditional celebration that could be drawn instead of resorting to an old stereotype.

Sauron97 said:
Theme parks, just like films, games, and other forms of entertainment, will be trashed if they start to fall victim to pandering to people who take offence at things which are 'fundamentally' subjective and above all else, not intentionally racist or harming anyone directly. Why? It limits creativity. It puts restraints on what you can and can't do. And that's a fundamental component to making something good I'm afraid.
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Totally I agree this kind of blanket thinking taken too far can limit creativity, although it's only really relevant to theme parks where there are moments of daft 'riské' humour that's all in the spirit of fun and doesnt take itself seriously (like that pirates scene).

I remember Terror Tomb at Chessington had its name changed to Forbidden Tomb because terrorism was in the news. Err just in case people actually thought an everyday word would be offensive? Pointless...
Although I wouldnt use the term "SJW", another overused buzz word.
 
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TakeYourMedicine said:
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Although I wouldnt use the term "SJW", another overused buzz word.
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Yes I absolutely agree, SJW is overused nowadays, and I admit I didn't enjoy typing it, but I couldn't really think of another word to use if I'm honest. It's a very particular and hard to define type of person that takes offence at almost everything. Then there's the 'boomers' who take offence about the taking of offence at almost everything... it's a lazy description but at the same time it isn't wrong.
I don't think that's true regarding the humor bit though, perhaps you misunderstand me; I think it's relevant to all areas of theme park design. Many theme park attractions have had their models/wax figures/ special effects changed not just because of an out of fashion joke but because of sheer attempts of realism. I've heard stories of entire ride scenes being changed because of religious reasons, gore/violence, and even people moaning about obviously scary rides being 'too scary'. Stuff like this kills creativity. Now if you don't enjoy these rides fine, I respect your opinion and I'd tell you to stay away from them, but lobbying to remove or change them. Get outta here you stupid morons.

On the main point re the Efteling topic, I'm not going to make a massive deal out of it. I can't be arsed. So long as nothing made in the future will be stifled out of fear of guest opinion, I don't think there's a major issue.
 
Quite a difference between 'toning down a ride that's supposed to be scary' and 'getting rid of bits that are racially insensitive' and I any 'creativity' that's killed of by the later being deemed unacceptable is probably for the best.
 
:tearsofjoy: What? Listing parts of my post in speech quotations doesn't make for much of a point matey. And yes, there is a correlation between the two. Both involve the taking of offence. You, for instance, seem to take offence at virtually everything that exists in the known universe. Perhaps that clears it up for you?

Either way, my point as a whole was not that racially insensitive stuff should be put in rides, well not stuff that intentionally and obviously depicts someone of a certain race or creed as inferior. That would be disgusting. But Efteling depicting African scenes as tribal or having dark appearances/frizzy hair/nose rings? There's literally nothing racist or negative about it. There's no insinuation whatsoever, but sadly some people like to look for one. To be honest, as a mixed race person myself, race is always a confusing topic, especially when the topic and toxicity of identity politics is brought in, but I still don't go out of my way to look for ways to take offence at these things.
 
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There is certainly merit to dicussion about rides at Efteling, whether or not they have racist connotations (I can't comment myself, the ride in question was closed when I visited) and any changes that the park may be making.

There is no merit in accusing people of having agendas and making said discussion more personal in the Efteling General Discussion thread. If you want to discuss that with each other then please do feel free to use the PM function!

I have removed some posts, let's try and keep things sensible.

Thanks!
 
Heard radio commercials for Efteling today. They must be having a push to gain more visitors from the UK.
 
IDB said:
Heard radio commercials for Efteling today. They must be having a push to gain more visitors from the UK.
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That's good to hear - which radio station was this on?

I need to have children so I can justify annual visits as well as multiple re-rides on Droomvlucht.
 
RicketyCricket said:
That's good to hear - which radio station was this on?

I need to have children so I can justify annual visits as well as multiple re-rides on Droomvlucht.
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Who needs to justify annual visits to Efteling? It's not Disney where entitled parents look down on adult only groups getting character photos...
 
They seem to claim that when you book Efteling Hotel through them you’ll get free park entry, almost like some exclusive offer. Considering that anyone staying in that hotel receives park entry, I’m not sure what their brand new “partnership” is actually offering.
 
It’s not really offering anything, it just opens up the park to a wider audience really.
 
venny said:
They seem to claim that when you book Efteling Hotel through them you’ll get free park entry, almost like some exclusive offer. Considering that anyone staying in that hotel receives park entry, I’m not sure what their brand new “partnership” is actually offering.
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Given that Towers have tickets on top of hotel price, most guests might not realise this and think it's good value (depends how much it is)...

It's good to see Efteling branching out though, I think the partnership is more for brand exposure rather than any value for money reasonings...
 
My family and I have booked a visit to The Efteling in April and my sister’s just turned vegan... :)eek:)

So, can anyone tell me what the Efteling’s vegan catering options are like? Also, are there any vegan options at Polle’s Keuken, as I’d really like to eat there?
 
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