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Secret Weapon 7 Discussion
- Thread starter Mark00us
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Cheese
TS Member
- Favourite Ride
- Helix, Liseberg
Well, I'm a bit late to the discussion on ‘The Smiler’ as a potential name for the ride, but here goes!
Beginning with ‘The’ is not a good starting point. This only works on The Swarm because the swarm it refers to consists of a large number of aliens/alien robots/alien weapons, and it only works for The Blade because Blade sounds a bit short and bland on its own. A good ride name stands nicely on its own without having to lean on ‘The’ for support.
‘Smiler’ isn’t even a word, and it sounds daft when spoken aloud. A ride is a machine and can’t smile. The only thing you would really refer to as a ‘smiler’ would be a person, and as smiling isn’t generally very notable behaviour to justify the title they’d need to be fairly unremarkable besides looking extremely pleased or creepy. As Tim said, it sounds like a nickname we’d give to a rubbish scare maze actor who’s either found in an ineffective, poorly thought-out scene or has a complete inability to scare guests.
It gets worse when you consider that to understand how it’s relevant you need to know that SW7 is being themed to the Ministry of Joy (and who they are for that matter!). I’d imagine that a relatively small proportion of Scarefest guests did The Sanctuary, and fewer still would have paid much attention to the video in the queue and realised what was supposed to be going on.
Even then ‘The Smiler’ doesn’t seem like a very MoJ term. We’re talking about an organisation that uses a process called Marmalisation. I’m fairly sure they’d choose a more complicated and ambiguous name than ‘The Smiler’ for a groundbreaking new treatment device.
Most importantly, I don’t think ‘The Smiler’ would work as a name for any ride, let alone a thrill coaster. Let’s not forget that SW7 is to be a hardcore inversion machine, arguably the most important coaster the park has built since Oblivion. You would expect such a ride to have an imposing name, and this just wouldn’t get the general public excited. If they go ahead with it as the name I’m dreading my colleagues asking me next March “Up to anything at the weekend?”, because when I reply “Yes. I’m going to Alton Towers for the opening of The Smiler”, I’m going to get some bemused faces and probably several responses of “The what?”.
I’m not against Towers using ‘The Smiler’ somewhere in SW7 (we’ll come to that shortly), but I’m 100% against them using it as the ride’s name. I now think it’s unlikely that I’ll be buying the current SW7 merchandise just in case, as ride merch can occasionally be a talking point. There’s no way I would want to explain to anyone that the unusual crazy smile plastered across the front refers to something so poorly named!
What would I suggest as an alternative then? There have already been plenty of suggestions on this topic that I feel would be preferable, but the best suggestion I’ve come up with so far is ‘Grinsane’. Sure, it’s not great (in fact it’s more than a little bit cheesy), but it still suggests that the Ministry wants to get you smiling while sounding like something special. I’m fairly sure that if I were just any old guest it’d be more likely to get me interested in visiting than ‘The Smiler’.
Regardless of what name is given to the attraction as a whole, I’d quite like it to not be used beyond the queue entrance as doing this properly can improve guest immersion. The best example I can think of is how on Tomb Blaster at Chessington you might expect to be taking the role of a Tomb Blaster or boarding a vehicle with that name, while in actual fact guests are ‘civilians’ and trains are ‘utility vehicles’. A slightly different example would be the news reports in The Swarm’s queue making no mention of the word ‘swarm’.
Once in the queue the ride hardware itself could be revealed to be a treatment device known internally by two names. The first name would be a fancy-sounding official name (‘The Social Satisfier Apparatus’ for instance), whereas the second would be an informal name used by both staff and patients that suggests that it’s notorious inside the facility (which is where ‘The Smiler’ could come in). You could see an initial video of Dr Kelman inviting you to undergo treatment on the new device where everything seems perfectly fine, only to find further along the queue ominous messages left by patients such as “THE SMILER AWAITS”. One of several increasingly creepy Ministry videos before you reach the station could be Professor Sherif sitting back in his chair saying something along the lines of:
“This is Professor Sherif speaking. Good day to you all.
It has come to my attention that some staff and advocates have taken to calling our revolutionary new treatment device, the Social Satisfier Apparatus, by the nickname ‘The Smiler’. We at the Ministry of Joy would like to make it clear that referring to this pioneering system in this manner will not be tolerated, and that anyone who does so will face mandatory enrolment in Dr Kelman’s ongoing marmalisation process development initiative. Thank you for your compliance.”
I realise that’s quite a complicated system, but it ensures that Marketing can have a snappy, memorable name without the ride development folks having to shoehorn it into an environment that implies that all is not as it seems at the X-Sector facility.
Beginning with ‘The’ is not a good starting point. This only works on The Swarm because the swarm it refers to consists of a large number of aliens/alien robots/alien weapons, and it only works for The Blade because Blade sounds a bit short and bland on its own. A good ride name stands nicely on its own without having to lean on ‘The’ for support.
‘Smiler’ isn’t even a word, and it sounds daft when spoken aloud. A ride is a machine and can’t smile. The only thing you would really refer to as a ‘smiler’ would be a person, and as smiling isn’t generally very notable behaviour to justify the title they’d need to be fairly unremarkable besides looking extremely pleased or creepy. As Tim said, it sounds like a nickname we’d give to a rubbish scare maze actor who’s either found in an ineffective, poorly thought-out scene or has a complete inability to scare guests.
It gets worse when you consider that to understand how it’s relevant you need to know that SW7 is being themed to the Ministry of Joy (and who they are for that matter!). I’d imagine that a relatively small proportion of Scarefest guests did The Sanctuary, and fewer still would have paid much attention to the video in the queue and realised what was supposed to be going on.
Even then ‘The Smiler’ doesn’t seem like a very MoJ term. We’re talking about an organisation that uses a process called Marmalisation. I’m fairly sure they’d choose a more complicated and ambiguous name than ‘The Smiler’ for a groundbreaking new treatment device.
Most importantly, I don’t think ‘The Smiler’ would work as a name for any ride, let alone a thrill coaster. Let’s not forget that SW7 is to be a hardcore inversion machine, arguably the most important coaster the park has built since Oblivion. You would expect such a ride to have an imposing name, and this just wouldn’t get the general public excited. If they go ahead with it as the name I’m dreading my colleagues asking me next March “Up to anything at the weekend?”, because when I reply “Yes. I’m going to Alton Towers for the opening of The Smiler”, I’m going to get some bemused faces and probably several responses of “The what?”.
I’m not against Towers using ‘The Smiler’ somewhere in SW7 (we’ll come to that shortly), but I’m 100% against them using it as the ride’s name. I now think it’s unlikely that I’ll be buying the current SW7 merchandise just in case, as ride merch can occasionally be a talking point. There’s no way I would want to explain to anyone that the unusual crazy smile plastered across the front refers to something so poorly named!
What would I suggest as an alternative then? There have already been plenty of suggestions on this topic that I feel would be preferable, but the best suggestion I’ve come up with so far is ‘Grinsane’. Sure, it’s not great (in fact it’s more than a little bit cheesy), but it still suggests that the Ministry wants to get you smiling while sounding like something special. I’m fairly sure that if I were just any old guest it’d be more likely to get me interested in visiting than ‘The Smiler’.
Regardless of what name is given to the attraction as a whole, I’d quite like it to not be used beyond the queue entrance as doing this properly can improve guest immersion. The best example I can think of is how on Tomb Blaster at Chessington you might expect to be taking the role of a Tomb Blaster or boarding a vehicle with that name, while in actual fact guests are ‘civilians’ and trains are ‘utility vehicles’. A slightly different example would be the news reports in The Swarm’s queue making no mention of the word ‘swarm’.
Once in the queue the ride hardware itself could be revealed to be a treatment device known internally by two names. The first name would be a fancy-sounding official name (‘The Social Satisfier Apparatus’ for instance), whereas the second would be an informal name used by both staff and patients that suggests that it’s notorious inside the facility (which is where ‘The Smiler’ could come in). You could see an initial video of Dr Kelman inviting you to undergo treatment on the new device where everything seems perfectly fine, only to find further along the queue ominous messages left by patients such as “THE SMILER AWAITS”. One of several increasingly creepy Ministry videos before you reach the station could be Professor Sherif sitting back in his chair saying something along the lines of:
“This is Professor Sherif speaking. Good day to you all.
It has come to my attention that some staff and advocates have taken to calling our revolutionary new treatment device, the Social Satisfier Apparatus, by the nickname ‘The Smiler’. We at the Ministry of Joy would like to make it clear that referring to this pioneering system in this manner will not be tolerated, and that anyone who does so will face mandatory enrolment in Dr Kelman’s ongoing marmalisation process development initiative. Thank you for your compliance.”
I realise that’s quite a complicated system, but it ensures that Marketing can have a snappy, memorable name without the ride development folks having to shoehorn it into an environment that implies that all is not as it seems at the X-Sector facility.
KingNemesis
TS Member
Unsure if mention but what if "The Smiler" is the name of the secret weapon? Think about it...
"Hello.. It seems you did not respond to previous treatment so we have invented our new advance in social compliance treatment.. The Smiler"
"Hello.. It seems you did not respond to previous treatment so we have invented our new advance in social compliance treatment.. The Smiler"
BigAl
TS Member
- Favourite Ride
- Forbidden Journey
SheikhSam said:
:
I read your whole post and made my comment. It's pointless speculation, not logic, which is why I posted about free cake being handed out because it's just as ridiculous. Not really much else to it. It's pointless speculation and it dragged the topic from being SW7 related to Sonic and egg related, so I asked if we could go back to the whole point of the thread. I'm not attacking discussion, I'm just not bothered about talking about Sonic or eggs. Especially here.
Anyway...
I really hope the ride isn't called 'The Smiler'. It's just going to get mocked by your average guest. It's definitely original, but that's because no other park in the world would be so foolish to give a white knuckle coaster like this such a pointless name. It comes across as if they spent two minutes looking at the 'MoJ' face and decided to name it after that. Not exactly imaginative. It doesn't have the same impact as 'Nemesis' or 'Oblivion' and only tells us that the ride will somehow link with a facial expression. What's worse is the fact that it sounds like a nickname for a weird bloke that smiles at everything. XD
Also, come Feb Half Term, we may need to check Oblivion to see if it has had some work done to help it with a new roller coaster sitting next to it. It's unlikely, but stranger things have happened!
James
TS Founding Member
Re: Sonic
It is relevant to the topic in some ways as early in the development there were rumours of SW7 having an IP, with Halo being the strong rumour. It was quickly known that there was no IP or Alton had dropped the IP idea.
This is a discussion topic about a ride that we know very little about. So I don't think we should shoot people down or quickly disregard ideas.
Sent from my iPod touch using Tapatalk
It is relevant to the topic in some ways as early in the development there were rumours of SW7 having an IP, with Halo being the strong rumour. It was quickly known that there was no IP or Alton had dropped the IP idea.
This is a discussion topic about a ride that we know very little about. So I don't think we should shoot people down or quickly disregard ideas.
Sent from my iPod touch using Tapatalk
BigAl
TS Member
- Favourite Ride
- Forbidden Journey
It's just that The Sanctuary is heavily related to SW7 and none of it suggests Sonic. The location doesn't suggest Sonic because it would completely ruin X-Sector (it'd be like building a Call of Duty themed B&M floorless in mutiny Bay), and also the Sega sponsorship for Sonic Spinball (also, they wouldn't have two rides with the same theme but in different areas) runs out next year (?). Am I all for discussion, but there's more chance of me winning the lottery next week than there is SW7 being Sonic themed.
But yes, my first comment about cake was a joke, though I wouldn't be mad if they did hand some out at the exit next year!
Sorry!
But yes, my first comment about cake was a joke, though I wouldn't be mad if they did hand some out at the exit next year!
Sorry!
James
TS Founding Member
Oh yes I know it's certain now that SW7 will have nothing to do with Sonic. Although my point generally stands towards other peoples ideas/views being shot down. A few members have posted some good points against Sonic being an IP for SW7. Although others have been rather rude. My post is aimed towards the members that are being rather rude to others.
Anyway, since Sonic gate is over lets get back to discussing other aspects of the ride.
The general opinion I've been getting from a lot of people at the moment is that 'The Smiler' is not much of an imaginative name. It doesn't feel like an 'Alton Towers' name and for people who know nothing of the ride or the type of ride they believe at first instance it's a kids ride or something quite calm and cheery. Not an imposing thrill roller coaster. Time will tell though if The Smiler does become the name of the ride, as at the moment the name of the ride has not been confirmed.
Anyway, since Sonic gate is over
lets get back to discussing other aspects of the ride. The general opinion I've been getting from a lot of people at the moment is that 'The Smiler' is not much of an imaginative name. It doesn't feel like an 'Alton Towers' name and for people who know nothing of the ride or the type of ride they believe at first instance it's a kids ride or something quite calm and cheery. Not an imposing thrill roller coaster. Time will tell though if The Smiler does become the name of the ride, as at the moment the name of the ride has not been confirmed.
Ted
TS Member
- Favourite Ride
- Kondaa
I somewhat feel that my Sonic fanboyism caused us to go off topic. So I'll take some of the blame, Sorry! :-[ Believe or not I don't want to this coaster to be Sonic Themed anyway
Anyway, we should get back on topic. I still think that this coaster will have a Nineteen Eighty-Four style themed. However since I wasn't at scarefest this year, I may as well be truly wrong! Still, it's a more likely theme then the famous blue hedgehog!
As for the name, I agree that "The Smiler" sounds like a character or object within the name, rather than the ride itself. My best bet for the name will be "Madness", I think it suits it quite well and can be caught on quite easily, like "Hey do you want to go on Nemesis, Oblivion or Madness first"? Doesn't sound bad at all in my opinion! It also makes me wonder how many people in 1997/1998 would guesses the name "Oblivion" whilst SW4 was under construction.
Anyway, we should get back on topic. I still think that this coaster will have a Nineteen Eighty-Four style themed. However since I wasn't at scarefest this year, I may as well be truly wrong! Still, it's a more likely theme then the famous blue hedgehog!
As for the name, I agree that "The Smiler" sounds like a character or object within the name, rather than the ride itself. My best bet for the name will be "Madness", I think it suits it quite well and can be caught on quite easily, like "Hey do you want to go on Nemesis, Oblivion or Madness first"? Doesn't sound bad at all in my opinion! It also makes me wonder how many people in 1997/1998 would guesses the name "Oblivion" whilst SW4 was under construction.
TheMan
TS Member
- Favourite Ride
- NemiLerVion
I want to highlight, what Magrathea and Craig mentioned earlier on - that it could be the name of a contraption in a pseudo-psychological fashion.
Why are people not seeing the humour in this? I thought the potential name was rubbish at first to be fair, but once that idea was thrown out it made perfect sense.
Marmalisation isn't exactly a common/sensible word is it? The Sanctuary, by it's name, it doing the opposite of what it is suggesting. Completely juxtaposed.
The Smiler turning out to be a sinister piece of "correction" equipment, I personally find brilliant. That's not simple or non-creative, it's part of a wide theme and story - and about time too!
As I say, IF it is indeed based around this theme (which is the most likely of all I have read so far), then I cannot wait!
I hope it is called "The Smiler" based on a sinister piece of correction equipment, and I couldn't care less if others like it or not, for me this direction is fantastic!
Stop taking it so seriously, it clearly isn't the idea, it's been tongue in cheek from the off and if it continues this way, you're in danger of missing the point and where the enjoyment is.
I'm not saying don't speculate etc obviously, but just take a step back and look at the wider direction of theme and attraction/maze etc.
If they pull this off, it will be absolutely fantastic - and there's still some mysterious element to be revealed yet too, and I just love the fact it's a good old fashioned loop and twist intense looking coaster!
Nothing will knock Nemmy, it's place is unique, not necessarily for what it she is now (though still brilliant), but what she represented. Nothing can take that away, but we may well have our most exciting coaster development since!
BRING IT ON TOWERS! Loving the work so far ;D
Humour folks, humour!
Why are people not seeing the humour in this? I thought the potential name was rubbish at first to be fair, but once that idea was thrown out it made perfect sense.
Marmalisation isn't exactly a common/sensible word is it? The Sanctuary, by it's name, it doing the opposite of what it is suggesting. Completely juxtaposed.
The Smiler turning out to be a sinister piece of "correction" equipment, I personally find brilliant. That's not simple or non-creative, it's part of a wide theme and story - and about time too!
As I say, IF it is indeed based around this theme (which is the most likely of all I have read so far), then I cannot wait!
I hope it is called "The Smiler" based on a sinister piece of correction equipment, and I couldn't care less if others like it or not, for me this direction is fantastic!
Stop taking it so seriously, it clearly isn't the idea, it's been tongue in cheek from the off and if it continues this way, you're in danger of missing the point and where the enjoyment is.
I'm not saying don't speculate etc obviously, but just take a step back and look at the wider direction of theme and attraction/maze etc.
If they pull this off, it will be absolutely fantastic - and there's still some mysterious element to be revealed yet too, and I just love the fact it's a good old fashioned loop and twist intense looking coaster!
Nothing will knock Nemmy, it's place is unique, not necessarily for what it she is now (though still brilliant), but what she represented. Nothing can take that away, but we may well have our most exciting coaster development since!
BRING IT ON TOWERS! Loving the work so far ;D
Humour folks, humour!
We were told Sanctuary was a prequel as much as I would love a ride from the same period,
I feel that it may be set as present day referring back to the sanctuary as a failed experiment many years ago. Hoping for some nice sanctuary related easter eggs.
As for the name, I don't like it... Simple as a name its not good, but a) I will get used to it, it just sounds strange at the moment and B) it may not even be the name!
Sent from my phone using Tapatalk, please excuse any ridiculous mistakes!
I feel that it may be set as present day referring back to the sanctuary as a failed experiment many years ago. Hoping for some nice sanctuary related easter eggs.
As for the name, I don't like it... Simple as a name its not good, but a) I will get used to it, it just sounds strange at the moment and B) it may not even be the name!
Sent from my phone using Tapatalk, please excuse any ridiculous mistakes!
TheMan
TS Member
- Favourite Ride
- NemiLerVion
The context will be important if it is the name, and if they mess it up Fredward, it will be lambasted and deservedly so.
I didn't realise that Sanctuary was a Prequel - that's interesting! That could create an entirely different dimension, and sinister edge.
Nice one mate
I didn't realise that Sanctuary was a Prequel - that's interesting! That could create an entirely different dimension, and sinister edge.
Nice one mate
TheMan said:The context will be important if it is the name, and if they mess it up Fredward, it will be lambasted and deservedly so.
I didn't realise that Sanctuary was a Prequel - that's interesting! That could create an entirely different dimension, and sinister edge.
Nice one mate
Im pretty sure, either way, whether it is a complete success, or not so much. It will be lambasted by people online, because "enthusiasts" always have their own visions of what they want, and if the company doesn't anything too far from that, people get unnecessarily upset or annoyed.
I think by them, possibly, making such a unique and bold decision for theming, after the general dissappointment of thirteen, they cant afford to fail.
Tim
TS Member
- Favourite Ride
- Air / Blue Fire
TheMan said:
By humour I guess you mean the Juxtaposition of giving a scary ride a not very threatening name? If so I am seeing it and do think that's a good idea.
But The Smiler just doesn't sound very good. You said it yourself when you first heard it you thought it "was rubbish". You might have grown to like it later but isn’t the whole purpose of a name to hit people with a bit of intrigue from the moment they hear it.
I agree with Cheese. There's nothing wrong with The Smiler being used as a part of the storyline but I’d rather see something punchier as the actual name.
Yes I will accept the name if that does turn out to be the case just like I accepted Th13teen and Rita. That doesn’t mean they couldn’t have been given better names. Plus I don’t think it is just my subjective taste that disagrees with It. As those who have read my trip reports/reviews will know I try to remain as objective as possible, yet something about this still bothers me.
TheMan said:
I'd rather they didn't mess it up to begin with
As for the supposed theme I haven’t read Nineteen Eighty-Four but the ideas sound fascination. What’s more it seems like it will perfectly match up with the current X-Sector.
TheMan
TS Member
- Favourite Ride
- NemiLerVion
I have to agree with both the esteemed gentleman above.
For me there is little room for error with this name, but if the focus is actually on something very potentially, well, trippy lol, and wierd The Smiler will work - it just might take a context to make this work.
It is, though, as pointed out risky to not have a ride with an immediate impression - but, much like an album that you grow fond of over time, rather than just loving straight away - it may well have far more longevity.
If it is the name though, it has to be good, well better than good - it really has to justify such a strange name for a thrill coaster!
I most certainly see and agree with your points though
It is that absurdity that has got me rather excited though, and I may be in a minority, but I'll now be disappointed if it ends up with some generic terror based word. AT has enough of these now.
For me there is little room for error with this name, but if the focus is actually on something very potentially, well, trippy lol, and wierd The Smiler will work - it just might take a context to make this work.
It is, though, as pointed out risky to not have a ride with an immediate impression - but, much like an album that you grow fond of over time, rather than just loving straight away - it may well have far more longevity.
If it is the name though, it has to be good, well better than good - it really has to justify such a strange name for a thrill coaster!
I most certainly see and agree with your points though
It is that absurdity that has got me rather excited though, and I may be in a minority, but I'll now be disappointed if it ends up with some generic terror based word. AT has enough of these now.
PG Ricey
TS Member
Im confused as to why your so sure its 'The Smiler'? There has been no mention of this at all on posters, trailers or advertising, sure they do say keep smiling in the sanctuary but isnt that just to add too the atmosphere?
At the moment I think its silly to be sure on a name when all we have seen is a subliminal logo, it could easily just be to throw us off track like with the TH13TEEN poster prior to construction, its just as equal to saying when we seen that the ride would be called surrender, iris or other eye related names its just to encourage speculation and probably has no relavence to the actual name, so why people are already 'sure' on the name I dont know.
Personaly I think this name is terrible, its to amatuerish for a ride of this relavance and sounds like one of your first attempts at an unimaginative ride in RCT3. Also may I add, I think starting the name with 'the' would also be a terrible idea as it makes thhe ride as a whole sound less imposing just look at other examples; nemesis, air, th13teen, oblivion. Short and relevant exactly what this needs to be!
At the moment I think its silly to be sure on a name when all we have seen is a subliminal logo, it could easily just be to throw us off track like with the TH13TEEN poster prior to construction, its just as equal to saying when we seen that the ride would be called surrender, iris or other eye related names its just to encourage speculation and probably has no relavence to the actual name, so why people are already 'sure' on the name I dont know.
Personaly I think this name is terrible, its to amatuerish for a ride of this relavance and sounds like one of your first attempts at an unimaginative ride in RCT3. Also may I add, I think starting the name with 'the' would also be a terrible idea as it makes thhe ride as a whole sound less imposing just look at other examples; nemesis, air, th13teen, oblivion. Short and relevant exactly what this needs to be!
TheMan
TS Member
- Favourite Ride
- NemiLerVion
Nothing so far points to a dark name does it. I think we can be more or less certain, or educated guess at least, that we won't get "Oblivion, or Nemesis" style names.
Spin Doctor would make sense if those cars are taken straight of Spinball (no, I'm not getting involved in that debate ha-ha!)
Oh please I hope it isn't that though, I hate spinny stuff for the most part!
I'll be really surprised given the Sanctuary, the smiley face etc, if we get a really dark name now.
What's everyone's best guess on a fraudulent happy name?
I'll stick with The Smiler. You never know, AT may read it and take some ideas ha-ha! ;D
The name has been trademarked, and difficulties with trademarking a "device" was discussed earlier - something, will be called The Smiler, and it was found in the same place the other Merlin coaster trademarks reside. It is, without question, the most solid piece of information that is to be had on the ride thus far.
Still speculation, and may well be wrong, but given the provenance surrounding it, the name is most certainly a very strong candidate. (The logo also could easily have a TM somewhere, if that "device" was the subject of the trademark, but I find no evidence of this personally anywhere).
Spin Doctor would make sense if those cars are taken straight of Spinball (no, I'm not getting involved in that debate ha-ha!)
Oh please I hope it isn't that though, I hate spinny stuff for the most part!
I'll be really surprised given the Sanctuary, the smiley face etc, if we get a really dark name now.
What's everyone's best guess on a fraudulent happy name?
I'll stick with The Smiler. You never know, AT may read it and take some ideas ha-ha! ;D
Pricey. said:
The name has been trademarked, and difficulties with trademarking a "device" was discussed earlier - something, will be called The Smiler, and it was found in the same place the other Merlin coaster trademarks reside. It is, without question, the most solid piece of information that is to be had on the ride thus far.
Still speculation, and may well be wrong, but given the provenance surrounding it, the name is most certainly a very strong candidate. (The logo also could easily have a TM somewhere, if that "device" was the subject of the trademark, but I find no evidence of this personally anywhere).
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