Secret Weapon 7 Discussion

[Anonymous]

I too find not only Ministry of Joy and The Sanctuary both intimidating and scary. The whole brand if you like is really well thought out and attention to detail so far has been perfect!

 

[Dave]

Interestingly when Th13teen opened people moaned about the lack of narrative but now SW7 will be spoiled by one?

Marmalisation is a cool word and really works when you heard it used in Sanctuary and the Smiley Face thing is just freaky. I completely and utterly disagree with you I'm afraid Chris, to me this ride has a lot going for it based on the background we know.

And how does a secret research facility not fit with the theme of X-Sector.... Which is themed as a secret research facility. All they are doing is giving a name to the people behind it.

 

[Moley]

I feel it has been too long since someone has mentioned the name being terrible. I actually quite like it and we don't actually have any evidence that the trademarked name is associated with the actual coaster, but I don't want to stand out too much.

 

[Dave]

I feel it has been too long since someone has mentioned the name being terrible. I actually quite like it and we don't actually have any evidence that the trademarked name is associated with the actual coaster, but I don't want to stand out too much.

Plenty of people like the idea of the Smiler being the name Moley, as you can see by reading the comments throughout the topic. But as always we have a beautiful multicolour of opinion. So no you don't stand-out at all.

 

[Rob]

Personally I am not a big fan of the whole brand they have created so far. The whole "smile" and "ministry of joy" business I am already sick of hearing, it's pretty tedious and not scary. The word marmalisation is just silly...it just sounds like marmalade and there is nothing scary about that.

None of it seems to have any relevance to X-Sector at the moment either - I hope we don't end up with another Air.

I think the whole thing just lacks any substance at the moment for it to be good, they need to get more elaborate. The likes of Air and Oblivion were very much focussed on the world first element and didn't really need much of a storyline, but with SW7 it is all about the coaster itself so they need to adopt more of a Nemesis approach to storytelling.

Did you go to Scarefest and do The Sanctuary? I'm guessing you didn't as if you did there's no way you could have posted that. There is already so much substance to SW7, and it all seems really well thought through. I am also confident that they will fit this in well with X-Sector one way or another.

 

[BigAl]

I did the maze twice and I don't feel like anything that I saw would fit in with X-Sector at all. The story behind the Sanctuary is naturally going to be good, considering they basically took an actual event/series of experiments that happened and renamed bits and bobs whilst adding some of their own ideas to make the attraction their own.

As much as the story is decent, it I don't feel like any of it fits with the mystery of X-Sector. X-Sector is supposed to be a high-tech, uber modern sinister facility carrying out tests on people with huge machines. Sure, The Sanctuary carried out tests on people but the hospital style and the nature of the tests are very different from what you see with Oblivion and what the Lord of Darkness explains throughout the area. The Sanctuary was made to look like an old hospital because they wanted to find out where they'd gone wrong 50 years ago, but even so, I still don't think that updating this 'MoJ' idea will bring things in-line with the nature of X-Sector.

I get the impression that the creative people are trying to shoehorn in a different idea to X-Sector and they're trying to do it in a very limited amount of space with just one compact Gerstlauer Eurofighter. Can the story behind one squished Eurofighter up the corner of the iconic X-Sector really bring much to the area that has and probably will still be dominated by Oblivion? As I've said before, them trying to work this into the rest of X-Sector as a background story just feels to me like they're trying to add pieces to a puzzle that would be better off being left unfinished. Part of the fun with Wardley's attractions is that you can sort of fill in the blank areas with your own thoughts, and the attractions become different things to different people.

I feel that other people trying to influence these older attractions is not really helping them or making the experiences better (look at what happened to Toyland Tours, the Haunted House, Vampire, Professor Burp's Bubbleworks and Terror Tomb... and even Nemesis with the addition of Sub Terra * controversial* ).

SW7's concept art, manufacturer, cramped layout and the story behind 'The Sanctuary' actually have me quite worried about what is going to happen to X-Sector when I return in 2013. I really don't want to find that my fears come true. I also hope that further down the line the ride will still be able to deliver (I'm expecting Alton's version of Saw and Colossus as one ride ) rather than get too rough and put people off. I don't mind rough rides like Saw, but I know a lot of people don't, so I'd hate to see all of the money being used for SW7 go to waste. :/

 

[aru]

I think people need to calm down a bit. There is no evidence what so ever that SW7 will just copy the Sanctuary. We know that SW7 will be loosely based on the Sanctuary, but beyond that we can only speculate. Mind control and sinister experiments are very X-Sector, aren't they?

Despite X-Sector being 'futuristic', it is actually quite dated. Not because it is looking worn and tatty, but it is very 90's 'new millennium' and in need of revitalisation in my view. SW7 will hopefully being something a bit more dynamic to X-Sector.

Also, think of what it is replacing!! ;D

 

[GaryH]

Personally I dont see there being ANY link between the Sanctuary and SW7 apart from the "Smile" theme going through them both. Thats where any similarity will end.

As for CoasterCrazyChris saying it wont fit in to X Sector - I htink he is coming from the naming point of view. We have Oblivion, Submission, Enterprize ..... The Smiler doesnt quite sound right does it?

Then again, given Alton's naming conventions lately (Nemesis, Blade, Forbidden Valley..... Air and also Thirteen, Dark Forest.....Rita) i'm not holding out much hope!

But I think any links between The Sanctuary and SW7 need to be forgotten. There wont be nurses, or doctors, or Dr Kelman. The only "hint" Alton were giving us from The Sanctuary was with regards the name of the ride.

 

[Sazzle]

The queueline video for The Sanctuary stated something along the lines of them welcoming advocates to the facility ahead of the Ministry of Joy's 2013 project, because they wanted to learn from past mistakes and take things forward.

The whole premise is around MAKING people smile, regardless of how its achieved or the consequences.

Mind control, experiments on the living, forcing a race of people to be happy... I'd say that's very sinister.

X-Sector is in dire need of an overhaul. After 14, nearly 15 years, its hardly futuristic, is it? It's shabby and the 'edge' needs sharpening. While renovating, it wouldn't be difficult to intertwine a new story for SW7.. surely?

Sent from my HTC Desire using Tapatalk 2

 

[GaryH]

The queueline video for The Sanctuary stated something along the lines of them welcoming advocates to the facility ahead of the Ministry of Joy's 2013 project, because they wanted to learn from past mistakes and take things forward.

The whole premise is around MAKING people smile, regardless of how its achieved or the consequences.

Mind control, experiments on the living, forcing a race of people to be happy... I'd say that's very sinister.

And here is where you have just hit the nail on the head.

To you - you understand the basis of the Sanctuary. You understand its about Mind Control, experiments, forcing people to be happy etc. Therefore, you understand the naming of the ride "The Smiler".

To Joe Public who make up lets say 98% of park visitors, it sounds like a cheap fairground ride and they wont understand what its about (and given Alton's lack of themeing on recent rides I also doubt they will be given any insight into what its about!)

Heck, I know what its about, I make up that small 2% and I still think its a god awful name for any ride (unless its on the back of a lorry going up and down the country charging people £2 a go).

 

[Harv]

People are saying it's sinister, but it's not sinister enough. 'The Smiler' feels like it wants to be intimidating far too much rather than actually being scary. I just can't like it, I really am trying but it's shockingly bad.

 

[Jonathan]

'The Smiler' is slowly growing on me, but I just don't think it's going to suit SW7 at all. I was talking to my support worker at uni a couple of hours ago, and when I mentioned the name to her, she wasn't very impressed with it. She reckoned it didn't sound sinister enough, so it seems to be not just us that aren't keen on it.

 

[Alastair]

I wish there were some construction updates to break up this incessant talk about the name. The quality of the ride comes before the name everyone!

 

[aru]

The queueline video for The Sanctuary stated something along the lines of them welcoming advocates to the facility ahead of the Ministry of Joy's 2013 project, because they wanted to learn from past mistakes and take things forward.

The whole premise is around MAKING people smile, regardless of how its achieved or the consequences.

Mind control, experiments on the living, forcing a race of people to be happy... I'd say that's very sinister.

And here is where you have just hit the nail on the head.

To you - you understand the basis of the Sanctuary. You understand its about Mind Control, experiments, forcing people to be happy etc. Therefore, you understand the naming of the ride "The Smiler".

To Joe Public who make up lets say 98% of park visitors, it sounds like a cheap fairground ride and they wont understand what its about (and given Alton's lack of themeing on recent rides I also doubt they will be given any insight into what its about!)

Heck, I know what its about, I make up that small 2% and I still think its a god awful name for any ride (unless its on the back of a lorry going up and down the country charging people £2 a go).

The themeing and story telling were pretty good on N:ST VII and The Sancturary - why all of a sudden does SW7 have to be dire?

 

[Equinox]

I'm agreeing with Chris and BigAl....

I went through The Sanctuary during scarefest, I've got to say I didn't like the maze at all.... And I hope to god that what was inside the maze itself isn't reflected in the ride come opening day.
I don't feel as if anything seen so far will fit with the area... I do however agree with a previous comment that the theme they have chosen is so deep it could be worked to a way that it could fit.

Keeping those fingers crossed very tightly.

 

[oliviamaeae]

The Sanctuary is SUCH a good name that I can't imagine they would give the great, imaginative choice to the scare maze there for less than a month of the season over the ride, which will have at least a 10 year run on site. The Smiler isn't even in the same league. I think it will be different

 

[TheMan]

I feel it has been too long since someone has mentioned the name being terrible. I actually quite like it and we don't actually have any evidence that the trademarked name is associated with the actual coaster, but I don't want to stand out too much.

You're far from in a minority, it's pretty evenly matched. I'm a HUGE fan of this name based on it being a sinister faux-friendly contraptionator! ;D

Also, there is evidence to more than suggest it is the rides name. Where it was discovered was in the midst of lots of other ride trademarks, hidden out of Britain.

The logo, the Ministry of Joy, and now a Trademark of "The Smiler" residing in the same place as other Merlin coaster attraction Trademarks.

It is not easy to get a Trademark. There has to be something substantial behind it.

I'll be very disappointed personally now if it is not the name.

I think people need to calm down a bit. There is no evidence what so ever that SW7 will just copy the Sanctuary. We know that SW7 will be loosely based on the Sanctuary, but beyond that we can only speculate. Mind control and sinister experiments are very X-Sector, aren't they?

Despite X-Sector being 'futuristic', it is actually quite dated. Not because it is looking worn and tatty, but it is very 90's 'new millennium' and in need of revitalisation in my view. SW7 will hopefully being something a bit more dynamic to X-Sector.

Agree here on both counts. There are actual g'ment projects worldwide that profess to be for one thing, are allegedly quite sinister, Sam did a fantastic post on this somewhere. It's actually based loosely on very real ideas!

And yes, the problem with having futuristic feeling rides, is that eventually that "future" catches up with them, and they're bugger all like reality!! (See BBC Tomorrows World, we should all be driving hover cars, with fully automated houses, that can float in mid air by now).

I don't think blivvy has actually reached that point yet, but only because it was done so phenomenally well in the first place. As it ages, it becomes quite Retro kool, but still sinister.

SW7 will be that sinister futuristic style, more 1984/steampunk than Star Wars - that makes it timeless, and it will fit in beautifully into X-Sector should they get the balance right.

I also think we should give the General Public more credit! To say this:

And here is where you have just hit the nail on the head.

To you - you understand the basis of the Sanctuary. You understand its about Mind Control, experiments, forcing people to be happy etc. Therefore, you understand the naming of the ride "The Smiler".

To Joe Public who make up lets say 98% of park visitors, it sounds like a cheap fairground ride and they wont understand what its about (and given Alton's lack of themeing on recent rides I also doubt they will be given any insight into what its about!)

Heck, I know what its about, I make up that small 2% and I still think its a god awful name for any ride (unless its on the back of a lorry going up and down the country charging people £2 a go).

Wow, is that ever ignorant. There are members of the public who will not get it, of course there are, but do me a favour eh!!

How on Earth did classic works like 1984, A Clockwork Orange maintain such a phenomenal following, as it still enjoys to this day, if we had a public that averse to the intelligentsia.

Just because a few kids in queues forget how to write/speak English properly, and shorten their grammar, does not an ignorant nation make!

This annoys me, that somehow, it's only us "enthusiasts" who will "get" a more high-brow storyline.

I mean, seriously? You think we're that much more open to theatre than 98% of the populus?

The books this kind of storyline are based around, are classics for a reason, and it sure isn't because only a select few enjoy or understand them!

 

[stretchy]

The video in the queue line for The Sanctuary implied that the sanctuary is just one experiment and that SW7 is another. The goal of The Sanctuary was to make you smile. Their method was to cut a smile into your face. Both of the times we got the actual Dr Kelman, he said repeatedly how the others at the ministry didn't like his techniques to make you smile.

I think that the actual SW7 will be headed by another DR/Professor I think. So will each of the other rides in the area.
I think Enterprise will be renamed Marmaliser and maybe have lights in the gondolas.
I think SW7 will be, as the rumours say, called The Smiler and to be honest, a name is just a name. no matter what it was called a fair majority of us fans wouldn't like it. But as long as its memorable then that's the key. A marketing campaign about making you smile would work excellently.
and whilst were at it, I think that the area around X sector will stay with its current government testing zone theme.

 

[GaryH]

Wow, is that ever ignorant. There are members of the public who will not get it, of course there are, but do me a favour eh!!

How on Earth did classic works like 1984, A Clockwork Orange maintain such a phenomenal following, as it still enjoys to this day, if we had a public that averse to the intelligentsia.

This annoys me, that somehow, it's only us "enthusiasts" who will "get" a more high-brow storyline.

I mean, seriously? You think we're that much more open to theatre than 98% of the populus?

The books this kind of storyline are based around, are classics for a reason, and it sure isn't because only a select few enjoy or understand them!

Oh calm down your going off on one : !!!! Clockwork Orange was a cult film - we are talking about a rollercoaster, completely different thing and different audiences.

And yes, mostly "us" "enthusiasts" will be the main ones who will understand the story line.

Go stand outside the exit to Nemesis one day and ask people the story line behind it. I guarantee over 90% would reply "dont know, dont really care, but it was a good ride".

Do the same for Thirteen. NST now has the video introduction but even then, ask people on the way out about the story behind it and many wont have a clue (but at least Nemesis Sub Terra sounds good huh).

I was making the point that while the enthusiasts and people following the ride and its background will perhaps understand the name "The Smiler", the majority of the people visiting the park won't, and unless Alton make a grand effort of themeing the thing, then they still wont while queueing to get on it and after riding it.

People being ignorant and people not understanding something (or not interested in it) are two completely different things - you're confused between the two.

 

[TheMan]

You mean the Nemesis that doesn't have a clear storyline or explanation anywhere? Or a ride in Dark Forest that also has no real clarity of storyline at all?

Why don't you ask the same question for Oblivion, which had and maintains a very clear storyline and intention, by way of information/drama that sets the scene all the way through the entirety of the queue line.

You made a statement that 98% of the public wont get it. You back that up with another generalisation that it's for "different audiences".

Sorry what?

I can't judge N:ST as I have not been on it yet.

People being ignorant and people not understanding something (or not interested in it) are two completely different things - you're confused between the two.

No, I am not, I just happen to believe that more than 2% of theme park goers in this Country deserve to be given a bit more credit.

It's a bit too easy when you have a more active interest in a subject, to place one's head up one's backside and believe few other people will "get it".

Not true.

I'm afraid to tell you, we aren't that special.

Of course, the ride/theme/name could turn out to be absolute nonsense, completely confused in theme and delivery. However if it goes in the direction that is more than suggested thus far, I applaud that, for once, there is more in depth level of thought going into delivering something a little more than a bit of exciting steel and some painted fibreglass.

You of course could be proven right! I do hope not however.