Matt N
TS Member
- Favourite Ride
- Shambhala (PortAventura Park)
I personally love TLC's updates! Keep up the great work guys!
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ℹ️ Heads up...
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Towers Loving Care
- Thread starter Randomizer462
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ChristmasPud
TS Member
It's completely out of principle that most people (incl. me) call it out. I don't care that the intention isn't to create propaganda. Yes the effect is exaggerated by the nature of social media, but the consequence is that it has sent out a completely disproportionate message to enthusiasts. I'm not trying to have a go at you or anyone, but here's my reasoning.
Why has the page not made it clear that there isn't really a "TLC programme" at all? It's largely just the same work that goes on every winter season.
Why has it taken credit for the heritage restorations last year, which were bound by planning clauses and not from Merlin's own motivation, as part of this 'TLC programme'? The money didn't come from a TLC budget and the works were done externally. Did they simply forget to mention all this info (which completely changes the context of the posts) in their "efforts to communicate the winter work that goes on at Alton Towers"? No - because obviously their intention is to use anything as "TLC" material.
And also, announcing a Duel project last year (with no indication of how significant the work would actually be) was obviously for the sake of creating anticipation, for fans who'd been repeatedly complaining about the ride's poor state on the page. Why then havn't they communicated that actually there isn't going to be a significant Duel refurbishment at all?
Any work that's actually done in Duel will no doubt be emphasised like the Hex TLC last year, which (among some good improvements) actually downgraded the lighting programming and audio system for no apparent reason.
To people who say it's not being promoted to the public, there are still almost 4000 followers on TLC Twitter and 3000 on TLC Facebook, and the posts are widely reposted through much bigger fan channels too. There is a TLC blog & link on the main Alton Towers website, with the 'Ride Safety' and 'Our Mission' sections.
It's for fans, yes, but it's not as exclusive as you think when that many fans see it and people obviously abide by it as the official word of Alton Towers.
I actually appreciate the basic idea of a closed season update page, but the way it's being done is misleading, so it should be called out as such - if simply for the sake of balance. It's nothing to do with the efforts of the individuals running it - they are representing Alton Towers.
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WickerManiac
TS Member
- Favourite Ride
- Colossus
ChristmasPud
TS Member
I didn't visit the year that board was up and missed that. That's even worse, and clearly for the public's benefit.
The real reason was to save operational cost, for the same reasons as the proposed cuts this year. But you see on other sites that many people still believe it was closed for a whole year of improvements and that it's certification that 'Merlin DO maintain the park'
Regardless of who came up with it and their intentions, it's obvious that the key reason the idea for a "TLC" feed was approved by superiors was to keep positive fan relations.
The real reason was to save operational cost, for the same reasons as the proposed cuts this year. But you see on other sites that many people still believe it was closed for a whole year of improvements and that it's certification that 'Merlin DO maintain the park'
Regardless of who came up with it and their intentions, it's obvious that the key reason the idea for a "TLC" feed was approved by superiors was to keep positive fan relations.
Dave
TS Founding Member
I disagree on the Hex point for two reasons.
1) A lot of what geeks have moaned about on hex has actually been elements restored from opening day (the hazard tape around the queue line).
2) The audio - my ex works in the AV world and Ohm speakers are well regarded (certainly better than Bose) amongst him and his colleagues and the works where definitely done by professional sound engineers. The audio is loud but my memory is that it always was this way, I assumed because of the environment. The lighting I have no knowledge of, it hasn’t offended me but I could say it is spot on.
Certainly TLC was used as an excuse for Hex closure, a lot of the work was less than obvious (the floors) but it still didn’t need a season to be done. Most of your post is very spot on.
But I also know the folk behind TLC have fought tooth and nail for the money they got and I won’t take that from them.
ChristmasPud
TS Member
I didn't mean anything technical, I meant the lighting no longer follows the scene at all, so the 'point' of the scene is vague and random now.
The original scene was simple (but effective) and was sequenced more or less like this:
-Video plays, static 'restoration work' lights around the room
-Thunder heard outside. The generator that 'powers' the room sparks and cuts out, so the TVs and 'work lights' cut out, putting the room in darkness. As if the lightning storm has caused a power cut.
-Then 'supernatural' dimmed lighting comes up around the billowing curtain, etc, and strobe lighting when the thunder strikes
-Then the generator slowly starts up again (with more sparks) and the 'work' lights pulse and come back with it, as if 'power restored'.
Now what happens is the 'work' lights cut out on the wrong cue (not when the generator that's supposedly powering them cuts out, but on the thunder sound now), then they randomly come back on the curtain during the 'supernatural' part. So the blackout is at the wrong time and not so effective.
There's no sense that the generator is powering the room now. It's a subtlety but defeats the effect of the scene by having lights come up and down at random.
The audio issue is not to do with Bose vs Ohm (there's no reason why Ohm shouldn't have sounded good as a brand of speaker in there), but the way it's been set up. In most spots in the room it's very harsh and trebly, this probably just an EQ error or something similar, so can be fixed with some work. In my experience it really hurts your ears if you're near the front and you can see people wince.
It raises the issue - what was the point in replacing the perfectly fine original system in the first place? Some speakers were blown and needed replacing anyway, but by changing the whole system - somehow - they made the preshow sound much worse. It also lacks all bass effect and sounds very thin in moments that used to have dramatic impact.
Oh good point, and I don't doubt that they have, and I commend them for this.
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Sm1lingAdvocate
TS Member
The best thing about this project is it shows there is still people in the company that care about the little things.
Benjsh
TS Member
- Favourite Ride
- Steel Vengeance
It's the big things that draw in the crowds but the little things that keep them coming back for more.
jon81uk
TS Member
And I’ve posted this several times, but for anyone that’s missed it, there is an interview with the individual who posts most of the TLC stuff here https://www.kiphakes.com/2017/06/behind-the-scenes-at-alton-towers-resort-towers-tlc.html
Rob
TS Team
- Favourite Ride
- Steel Vengeance
Unfortunately there is just no pleasing some people! Hex is clearly in a far better condition now than when it closed - some will still moan. Nemesis looks brilliant - some people will still moan.
There is a hell of a lot that Alton Towers and Merlin can justifiably be criticised for without the need to moan about the few good things that do happen. TLC is a way to try and show us, enthusiasts, that they do try and improve the look of the park over the closed season with the limited resources that they have. Yes technically things like heritage resortations do not come out of the TLC budget but the TLC feeds are the best place to show this off in a bit of a geeky way.
I don't like it when they say a ride is closed for a year or two for some TLC, because we all know that is a load of rubbish, but on the whole it is something good and harmless.
Maybe it would have been easier for Alton Towers to just not give it a name and not show us what they are up to though. Although I have no doubts that people would then moan about Alton Towers not showing us any closed season photos!
There is a hell of a lot that Alton Towers and Merlin can justifiably be criticised for without the need to moan about the few good things that do happen. TLC is a way to try and show us, enthusiasts, that they do try and improve the look of the park over the closed season with the limited resources that they have. Yes technically things like heritage resortations do not come out of the TLC budget but the TLC feeds are the best place to show this off in a bit of a geeky way.
I don't like it when they say a ride is closed for a year or two for some TLC, because we all know that is a load of rubbish, but on the whole it is something good and harmless.
Maybe it would have been easier for Alton Towers to just not give it a name and not show us what they are up to though. Although I have no doubts that people would then moan about Alton Towers not showing us any closed season photos!
jon81uk
TS Member
As in general it isn't the same work that goes on every winter. 90% of the TLC stuff has only happened because Wayne Burton has pushed to make it happen and to get a budget for it. Most of the things that have been cleaned or painted in the last three years hadn't been touched for the 10 years before that. If they were doing this stuff every year there wouldn't have been rotting theming in Mutiny Bay or washed out colours on Nemesis.
The TLC project is ontop of winter maintanence and is trying to get the park back up to the standard it should always be.
Yes some of the park manager jumped on the bandwagon and used it as an excuse for some of the time with Hex, but the original intention of Wayne's project was good.
Also yes the conservatory might be connected to planning permission, but isn't it nice to see photos of it being done?
I'm with @AstroDan on this, it is a great project pushed through by a geek within Alton Towers because no-one else in park management had the passion to make Alton Towers great again.
I don't have a problem with the TLC programme. I really enjoy reading and seeing the updates.
However - I do get where some people are coming from.
Yes - the park should have annual maintenance which would involve re-painting, cleaning, maintaining etc.
Yes - some things which have been done, such as the Pagoda fountain may have only been done as a result of getting the planning permission for SW8
Yes - some rides and attractions have been closed due to cost cuts and put under the guise of being for TLC
But - you cant deny it is good to see the work that is taking place over the closed season, even if its just for the benefit of the enthusiasts.
However - I do get where some people are coming from.
Yes - the park should have annual maintenance which would involve re-painting, cleaning, maintaining etc.
Yes - some things which have been done, such as the Pagoda fountain may have only been done as a result of getting the planning permission for SW8
Yes - some rides and attractions have been closed due to cost cuts and put under the guise of being for TLC
But - you cant deny it is good to see the work that is taking place over the closed season, even if its just for the benefit of the enthusiasts.
There was also a sign like that for CharlieI agree with all the points @AstroDan raises subject to one exception. The propaganda aspect.
Let me re-cast your mind to what was a smoke screen for the closures in 2016... There is quite clearly a TLC logo on the entrance board.
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ChristmasPud
TS Member
This is part and parcel of when a huge multinational company funds its parks poorly. The misleading aspects of TLC are perhaps a necessary evil to get the jobs done well enough, but this whole situation is clearly part of a wider issue.
I've said many times I love the other great improvements in Hex, and I agree is a far better attraction than just before the closure. But there were still some flawed decisions that worsened the guest experience in places.
And that the Nemesis repaint has greatly improved the station, after years of needing it, and looks better than photos show it did in 1994! It's fantastic that this has been done professionally and makes a huge difference to the area. I'd sing these praises all day long. Although it's a shame that the track repainting was never finished and looks naff.
I know that the same thorough touch ups with lighting and audio has happened before in Hex and Duel too, to good standards considering the low budgets (and again just out of individuals' efforts), just it hasn't been promoted in the past.
I have reasoned everything else. I'm not being pedantic. If you got the second largest home improvements company in the world to redo your home, and the furniture was improved but the walls badly repainted, you wouldn't expect them to say "well it was just one individual's efforts to improve the house, no pleasing some people". Guests pay for this value in the experience with their ticket.
Also, I maintain that this is typical winter work, it's just that it happens so irregularly that it seems significant. Yes it wouldnt have happened without individual's efforts, but that is usually how all winter scenic and AV maintenance happens in UK parks, and has often happened that way (unfortunately). It's no different to Oblivion's repaint in 2013, Duel's new lighting/cleaning in 2010, the countless repainted buildings over the years, etc. So the effort is very commendable as ever, but DIY efforts are still open to criticism. There is still no proper structured funding in place for this stuff, unfortunately, so TLC shouldnt pretend to be one.
Not at all, just because I disagree doesn't mean "there's no pleasing" me or most others. I don't seek to criticise stuff for the sake of it, I go to enjoy the park and have fun. But I do criticise when something is made worse unnecessarily, because I appreciate the difference it will make to the guest experience, when better decisions can be made.
I've said many times I love the other great improvements in Hex, and I agree is a far better attraction than just before the closure. But there were still some flawed decisions that worsened the guest experience in places.
And that the Nemesis repaint has greatly improved the station, after years of needing it, and looks better than photos show it did in 1994! It's fantastic that this has been done professionally and makes a huge difference to the area. I'd sing these praises all day long. Although it's a shame that the track repainting was never finished and looks naff.
I know that the same thorough touch ups with lighting and audio has happened before in Hex and Duel too, to good standards considering the low budgets (and again just out of individuals' efforts), just it hasn't been promoted in the past.
I have reasoned everything else. I'm not being pedantic. If you got the second largest home improvements company in the world to redo your home, and the furniture was improved but the walls badly repainted, you wouldn't expect them to say "well it was just one individual's efforts to improve the house, no pleasing some people". Guests pay for this value in the experience with their ticket.
Also, I maintain that this is typical winter work, it's just that it happens so irregularly that it seems significant. Yes it wouldnt have happened without individual's efforts, but that is usually how all winter scenic and AV maintenance happens in UK parks, and has often happened that way (unfortunately). It's no different to Oblivion's repaint in 2013, Duel's new lighting/cleaning in 2010, the countless repainted buildings over the years, etc. So the effort is very commendable as ever, but DIY efforts are still open to criticism. There is still no proper structured funding in place for this stuff, unfortunately, so TLC shouldnt pretend to be one.
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Dar
TS Member
- Favourite Ride
- Taron
Fair enough if it is just one person's enthusiasm, but that doesn't take away from the fact that the park should never have been left to get into such a state that such a programme was necessary. And the fact that said enthusiastic person had to go to such lengths to secure the funding. Consider most of my rantings and ravings aimed at Merlin, and not at the people at Towers.
To be honest, electricBill has summed it up far more eloquently than I could and I'm just bored of the whole song and dance now and just wish they could be honest with their customers and not take us for mugs every time.
To be honest, electricBill has summed it up far more eloquently than I could and I'm just bored of the whole song and dance now and just wish they could be honest with their customers and not take us for mugs every time.
